Why go so deep? losing fat isn't that complicated, and this is the problem, people don't know what to do because there is so many methods it's just saturated and people skip from one method to another to another because they arn't losing it quickly enough. And about the Government getting sued, that would not be a problem (there must be a law in place that protects anyone giving advice i.e. Use this information at your own risk, we are not liable etc. Well, it works, but so does the Atkins diet, and the South Beach diet, and Slim Fast, and Cabbage Soup diet, they all do ONE thing, lower calories, and lowering calories makes you lose weight, period. But, they also don't work for hundreds of thousands of people around the world. The way I lost weight was not a "plan", it was an understanding of food and excerise as a whole, straight to the point, no profit involved weight loss. If someone wants to lose weight, they have to be motivated, otherwise it won't happen, but with all the crap with "lose 12lb in 4 weeks" going around, people don't have patience to go the proper route and want a quick solution. I said I won't repeat myself, but I guess I do cause you do too with these silly statements. I was overweight for the majority of my life, therefore my skin has never, ever, been normal (maybe at age 7 or something). When your skin has been stretched for that long, and that much, and you have thick skin, it won't go back regardless of what I done. Did you no read my previous posts? considering you quoted them I would of thought you would have. People that put on weight are always going to have a memory of being fat (unless they have super genetics or, where not overweight for long, therefore their skin can spring back. Gar has massive stretch marks, and they will never, ever, go (like mine). The skin is damaged and that's it, like a burns victim, his skin will never ever be the same again. You cannot put every single bodybuilder into one bucket, that is just craziness, the term "bodybuilder" is used for people who want to make their body look better. Nell McAndrew is a bodybuilder, but would you think that looking at her? so are many "normal" looking people. If you lift weights to gain a little bit of muscle, you are a bodybuilder. Like anything, you have an extreme of it, the extreme of eating food is obesity, the extreme for running is a 150 mile race up and down mountains, the extreme for swimming is a marathon in the ocean. The extreme for bodybuilding is this. http://graysmatter.codivation.com/content/binary/Ronniecoleman.jpg (Amazing stuff btw, super hard to get to that, regardless of steroid usage, he is a legend) And if you think that's exteme, there are bigger freaks out there. Also, your 2lb statement is again, wrong. Weight is not fat, and 2lbs a week is for fat loss, anything over that and you are sarcraficing muscle, this is used when someone is not overweight and needs to lose just fat (I don't care about medical guidelines, they are there to protect silly people). A person of 20 stone could lose 10lbs a week for a few weeks, then 5lbs a week for a few weeks after that, a person of 30 stone could lose 10lbs a week for a month. Nexxo, I'm quite a harsh person sometimes, and I don't like to be harsh in some cases, and this is one of them, but, if the Government was a computer, and it could write stuff, it would be writing what you are writing here. The Doctors I have seen for weight loss sound just like you, and they had no idea about weightloss, they just read guidelines and then passed it on to me. One Doctor told me to run 7 days a week, and that all I needed to do was to burn off more than I ate (I laugh at this statement now). I read weightloss forums nearly every single day, and have done for the last 3 years, I know what works, and I know what doesn't, Ive seen people lose 10 stone, and the people who lose serious weight normally do it the way I did, because it just works, and it isn't extreme, it's normal. And about extremes, if i'm so wrong, tell me why a gastic band is so popular now? Even the NHS give them out all the out, and that's just wrong (fair enough for people who weight a ton though). You eat a silly amount of food per day and you don't get fit at the same time or gain knowledge.
Roniie Coleman was/ is good, but I'll always be a Dorian yates fan! If you want extereme bodybuilding try supressing myostantin like this guy did! http://xigre.com/datatxt/media/2/20080712-supermisic.jpg Iremember reading about it in muscle & fitness about 10 years ago. Now that was worrying! especialy back then.
Yea, I was thinking that while looking underthe shadow of the guys left arm, but look at it this way, could you imagine what we would look like having supressed that gene? http://www.got-big.de/Blog/myostatin.jpg I don't mean looking like the above!lol, but with similar muscular protortions!
There is a child in Germany who was born with the same thing I think, this is a picture of it. http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/photos/baby_beefcake_cp_5995886.jpg Was a few years back I think, shame they haven't released a new picture of the kid!
No. The speed at which you gain weight, the time that you are overweight, and the speed at which you lose weight are all contributing factors. Flabby skin is minimised by a slow and gradual weight loss that allows skin to adapt and for lost fat tissue to be replaced with muscle mass. Hence the 2lbs. per week rule: even professional body builders strongly advise you to stick to it. Exactly. You yourself say: Now convince people that your plan actually works, get them to understand it, to stick to all the hard work it involves, and to use it appropriately to their personal health, fitness and age. Are we motivating people yet? Take smoking. Everyone knows smoking is bad; The government has made great efforts to make everyone aware of that. It is an expensive, and with public smoking bans, an increasingly difficult habit to indulge in. The government has also invested £138 million in free NHS smoking cessation and nicotine replacement programmes from 2003 to 2006. Stopping smoking is not rocket science. But guess how many smokers quit? Fifteen percent. Now translate that to something as complex as getting people to eat healthily, exercise more and lose weight. Sorry, doesn't work like that. The NHS does not get to do disclaimers. The NHS is legally responsible for all the health advice that it gives. Just like a doctor. And anyway: just how motivating is it to say: "Use this at your own risk"? I'm not going to argue about that because in the end, unless we roll back time and reproduce the conditions, we'll never find out for sure. What I do know is that even professional body builders advise you to stick to the 2lbs. per week rule. I think that sums up where you are coming from. And yet there you are with your excess skin. I know, I know, it would have happened anyway. We'll just have to agree to disagree on this one. In any case, the general population is not you. Just because you are bright, knowledgable, physically capable and motivated to lose weight, does not mean everyone else is. The gastric band is popular because of the reasons you outlined above: people want a quick fix that requires little effort on their part. The NHS is still heavily oriented towards medical rather than behavioural solutions. Psychologists don't believe in gastric bands; many surgeons don't either. The medical evidence is quite clear that it does not work. But in private health care it's a good income generator and in the NHS it is easier to give someone a gastric band than to find a clinical psychologist to try and modify the behaviour, just as it is easier to prescribe people Prozac than to send them to a clinical psychologist (there are about 3000 of us in the whole of the UK). And like other addicts, they are a spectacularly difficult patient group to motivate. I mean, think about it: these are patients who prefer to be seriously fat, with all the disability and health risks that it brings, and to undergo a life-threatening surgery, with all the accompanying pain and discomfort, rather than to just curb their eating and excercise some. All that is changing. Just like it took 30 years before the NHS realised that cognitive-behavioural therapy is more effective than anti-depressants or anti-anxiolitics (CBT was invented in 1967), it took some time to realise that when it comes to the modification of unhealthy behaviours, perhaps psycholoogists know a thing or two. Under the NHS IAPT (Improving Access to Psychological Therapies) programme, you can expect a lot more behavioural approaches to these problems in the future.
I know, I stated this in a few posts back, and genetics and age also play factors in it. You want to see how I could motivate and convince people my plan works? Ok, here you go. http://www.teenbodybuilding.com/sammy_el_tawil.htm Convince you enough? (Skin might not look too bad there, but it was unbelievable back then (look at the waistline in the picture with me with the white shorts), and I will be at that point once again with added muscle in 8 - 12 weeks) Well, they should. A lot of bodybuilding forums protect themselves with statements like "These routines are from personal opinion and not the opinion of the owers of the website, please check with your GP before following any weight loss plan" etc. Some forums even have insurance! - It's to just cover themselves from people who might develop an injury etc and blame it on the website. Well they don't deserve to be thin, period. One of the idiots on The Biggest Looser put all his weight back on, I mean, how can you do that to yourself, it is unbelievable. If you can do that to yourself, you have an problem somewhere, and it needs to be fixed fast.
Nexxo, how does the skin physically adapt, that is what I''m really wanting to grasp. I understand how stretched skin can do back to an extent. I don't have a problem with that, and how there could be a prallel connection between loosing weight and skin retension. What I REALLY don't know is, does the skin create new cells to adapt to slow weight gain, or do the cells retain more water, fat content, collogen, etc which allows the original cells to effetively grow, or stretch? If the cells have lower hyration levels and less collagen than ususal, I could understand the skin shrinking, but I cannot understand how it would remember to return to it's normal size, if the body did not ever understand what normal was, like I beleive Majors body didn't. Unless his nervous system was reprogrammed then I don't know how it would be possible. For me it was different I think due to the fact that I was normally thin became heavy too rapidly therefore the skin could not adapt, but thankfully it could remember what the original state was it returnd to normal despite my quick weight loss. Now I think if I'd been heavier for longer, I would have had loose skin due to weight loose, just like as my body ages, it gradually forgets what the original cells were like. If it's true that new cells were created, I can't imagine how the body could cannibalize itself like that. It's just like when people think they have created new muscles, or grown a six pack, we know that you don't add new myofibrils, we just grow them in terms of size. Not wanting to nit pick for the sake of it, or to prove a point here. I just want a better understanding. On the guidelines for two pounds a week weight loss, BMI, and 220 minus your age for finding your max pulse, I would say those guidlines are ok, but hardly an accurate figure, it's seemly more or less based on the averge stats of people rather than a help to someone looking an accurate measure like major, or I.
Major, your diet is remarkably similar to mine! This is what I ate today. (bare in mind I have to compromise because I live at home) Morning. Oats mixed with dried fruit, (pure orange juice, for high glycemic metabolism boost) Snack. Pear (low gylcemic to remain stable) and mixed nuts Lunch. Changed from bread to rivita, mixed salad, mackrel snack, same as earlier snack. Dinner, spag bol, but with smaller portion of spag. Evening, I have a hot choc and a small bar as a reward for sticking to my diet (thats my micro goal reward) I advocate multi vits, and oils also, and an increased intake of water, for good hydration and so my body dosent sotre excess water. I also use spices to increase my metabolism. My personal goal, having lost the weight, is to make my body as efficent as it can be, but having that integrated in to a fairly normal lifestyle. No fads, or unacheiveable goals. When we think about it, it's all balance and common sense thats been put into play. There's no reason why we couldnt have lost weight in more radical ways. There needs to be a turning point in life to make weightloss effective.
Indeed, our way is the proper way imo. Hot Choc and bar is totally fine if you are not eating 2500 + that, if it all fits in, then it's 100% fine (unless you treat your body like a temple like some). Water wise, I prob drink 2-3L a day (including water when I workout, protein shakes etc), it makes you feel so much better, and if I don't drink enough, I just feel like crap. When I cut, I eat so much veg I feel more fuller than when I am bulking, my plate is a mountain of veg with meat (no proper carbs when cutting, except beans). Having a week off of weights though, elbows are knackered.
Fit, dude. But pictures like that are employed by every gym and weight loss programme. They are good for people who are already motivated and just looking for an effective method, but they are not nearly enough to get a couch potato off the settee and keep them going. Ask a sports psychologists or fitness trainers who work with the obese. It's a whole different ballgame from the motivated, functional people you are thinking of. There were some TV programmes like that a few years ago (ITV I think), in which a professional trainer was recruited to work with a selected sample of obese people. It blew his mind (me, I was saying: "Welcome to my world, suckah!"). He couldn't get his head around the sheer dysfunctionality of these people. It is not unlike working with alcoholics or drug addicts. They can't. Metaphorically speaking, the NHS is the GP. There is no-one else to offload the medical responsibility on. The buck stops with them. You're right on the button: we're not dealing with functional people here. To consider them addicted (to eating) would be a reasonable way of looking at it. To motivate the seriously obese would be like motivating alcoholics to give up drink, or drug addicts to give up drugs, or compulsive gamblers to give up gambling. Now consider how far addicts will go in destroying their lives, their bodies, their families, and this does not make them stop. You are quite functional. At some point you took a look at yourself and said: "I've got to change this", and you did, whatever it took. The people we are talking about never get to that point, or much beyond it. Skin is incredibly flexible --just think of a pregnant woman. Moreover, The epidermal cells that cover the entire surface of our skin never get older than one month. New cells are continually produced (by cell division) deep in the epidermis, while the older ones continually slough off at the surface*. So it is quite easy for our skin to grow or lose cells on demand, so to speak. Skin does not "remember" what size or shape it should be --it just tends to follow the scaffold of the body. Yup, because unless someone can do an exact analysis of your skin condition, fat distribution, age, genetics, and a detailed history of your weight gain and retention, general rules are what we are stuck with. One size needs to fit all, safely and reliably. * Similarly, the cells lining our intestines completely replace themselves every four days; our red blood cells are entirely replaced about every 90 days; and our white blood cells are replaced about every week. Even cells that never (or rarely) divide, such as cardiac muscle cells and brain cells, turn over molecule by molecule. It is believed that little or nothing in our body is more than about 10 years old. Thus, thanks to cell turnover and replacement, most of the organs in the body of a 90-year-old man are perhaps no older than those of a child. The reason our body ages is because repeated replication leads to gradual degeneration of cell quality and number.
Very interesting Nexxo. So at the epidermis, will the skin multiply cells so the surface of the skin actually has more than it used to in order to acommadate and assist an increase of the skins surface area? If I am very overweight, will I simply have more cells than I used to? I know, you should really tell me to go and read a book and I should just for now your info does explain what I am aiming to understand. I'm mostly having trouble understanding how you have actually accumulated this knowledge! (and in your own way appear fairly humble) Not trying to big you up, just being honest. Of course I will have to take legal action if I find out that you spend all day on wikipedia and don't actually work in the medical feild! I know I've argued with you in the past etc, but I have to say you pretty much (obviously not all of the time, as you are human, lol) all the time have a water tight case. V talented either way.. As far as finding out my heart rate is concerned from a medical point of view, 220 minus your age may work in a very broad sense, but to simply put as as advice in a sports science journal is fustrating. If I was to follow that rule, I would always be cycling well below my true anerobic threshold as I'm 27 and my max pulse is 207. I'd be ten beats off in that case. Just like if I had very thick bones and allot of muscle mass, the gp would have to tell me that I'm overweight according to the bmi. Why can't the gp just say, I'm sorry this chart is not an exact science, we are fallable. I find a gp just having info is not enough, they should be paid to go a step further. Care about what your paitent is telling you, just don't Lord is over them. Thast been my experience, it's actually thanks to gps, and sports rehab units, physios not caring enough that I have been able to learn how to fix my own body. Otherwise I can garuntee you I'd be on benefits and in a wheelchair at this point. I just wish people wouldnt simply be in the medical field for the money. Thats what my gripe is.
I would imagine so. Not sure anyone has ever tried to do a study on that. I read a lot. I don't recall exact figures most of the time, but it is easy to just Google those. Yeah, there is a lot of human variability. The problem is that GPs know a little bit of everything, and are experts on nothing (jack of all trades, master of none...). Their average patient-load is 5000, and generally they deal with mundane complaints every day --and have perhaps 5-10 minutes a patient to do so. If a GP truly wanted to stay up-to-date with all current medical knowledge, he'd have to read 7 medical articles a day. Just not feasible. It is always best to become an expert on your own health if possible.
i like this, people are lazy, and they can get away with it because its unpublishable. Eat crap, do no exercise, become fat, cause nationwide panic about obesity, cost the NHS time & money, subsequently we get "taxing chocolate" ideas from idiots... Healthy diet and exercise. would do this world a **** load of good.
Well, I would say that I was addicted to eating before the weightloss, but that was because of depression and having a crap time at school. Nearly everynight around 10pm I would make 2 Pitta bread stuffed with cheese and ham, and maybe have a muffin or something, and that was on top of 2500, but because I was so heavy, and I was the opposite of fit, it was just storing as fat. I personally think (as I have gone through it) that obesity, is a disese, it sounds silly, but you don't realize your overweight until "you" realize you are overweight, and that's normally when you are 80lbs overweight and have been like it for 5 years. Maybe it's your brain that triggers something, but your brain must play a part in it all, I thought I looked much thinner than I did. Regarding skin, I just found this.
Well thats the thing. I had to address the physcological issues I had, before I could be sucessful in my own diet. I had to understand my relationsip with food and what food meant to me. I was saddened to learn that food had become a friend that I thought wasnt letting me down, when it reailty it was destroying my body. To complete the diet I had to be honest with myself. I live in a world full of junk food and quick fixes, and I feel thats something I can't control, so I still choose to eat junk, but I'm very selective about the junk that I eat, and it hasnt for one second hidered my progress, only helped it. When I give someone a diet to follow they are suprised at what they can actually eat and how tasty it is. I find that most of them don't know much about foods, or how to even cook, so they rely on what they can buy, or what they are handed at home. Then when their palette becomes educated, suddenly eating a McDonald's feels disgusting. Sadly we have been conditioned to like all the wrong things, and all the things that were good have lost their true taste. What a shame it is. The lifestyle we are told is equipping us to do more in less time is actually teaching us to do nothing for a long time.
Read the quote Major, and I reckon you'll be sharing the same idea as me here. Well thats the thing I don't get. You can't tone, or firm up muscles to any extent. They either grow or shrink. You loose fat surrounding the muscle, and so you can see the definition of the muscle under the skin. It amazes me that some people think you can develop an eight pack!lol
Morbid obesity is a condition; more specifically it is partly a psychological condition. It is caused by dysfunctional psychology and behaviour and maintained by psychological, behavioural and physical factors. People who are seriously overweight do have distorted body image and body experience. They have a distorted perception and experience of food. It does alter metabolism and hence also brain processes associated with metabolic processes. There is a distorted sense of hunger, satiety, body perception etc. Then there are socio-cultural factors: whether obesity is culturally "normal" or challenged, whether it is easy to over-eat or eat healthily, whether it is commonly known what is healthy and unhealthy food and eating. There are also practical environmental considerations in terms of availability of food and what types, availability of means for behaviour change etc. As has been said: it is all pretty complex.
