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The Coronavirus Thread

Discussion in 'Serious' started by d_stilgar, 13 Mar 2020.

  1. liratheal

    liratheal Sharing is Caring

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    So.. You think it's coincidence that the people in government that're vocal about wanting to shut the NHS up in favour of privatisation are also the ones that're voting that way?

    I'm not an NHS employee, and for a long time I never went near a doctor or a hospital (Through lack of need), but it is impossible to not notice things. Like private ambulance services. Like private companies doing certain scans that the facility has capacity for. Like private porter staff. Private maintenance staff.

    Like the way consultancy seems to be encouraged rather than direct employment - Which, what little I know of their hourly rates, would explain why the doctor parking outside the chemo ward I spent far too many hours at had more expensive cars parked there than I've seen in one place at one time without going to a museum or a car show.

    The NHS is underfunded, that much is an indisputable fact. The reason it's underfunded is that certain people keep voting to keep it that way. The same kind of people that write oped pieces in whichever newspaper will pay them about how the NHS is **** and must be changed for something else.

    I must admit, to me, it's never really factored into a concern realm. Even when I lived in the UK, I earned enough that I'd have been alright whatever happened to the NHS. But that's not true of everyone. You've posted a lot in various threads about how you've needed government support to not have to shut your business(es?) down in this time of crisis. I somehow doubt that, were you suddenly required to, you'd be singing from the hills the praises for expensive health insurance (Because I guarantee you it'll be more than NI - And that NI wouldn't go away, or down).

    The NHS is in this situation because it's consistently underfunded, seemingly mismanaged, and then the people voting for lowering funding complaining that its performance is crap.

    That tactic is neither new, nor uncommon - Look at the USPS at the moment. Some politicians have consistently voted to shred their funding one way or another, and are now calling it an unsustainable and suggesting that private companies should do the job instead.

    You can claim it's all BS and the NHS isn't hurting because of MP's decisions to line their pockets rather than giving their constituents free (ish) healthcare, but you're wrong. It's slow, but it's happening.

    Also, it's not something exclusive to any one party, IMO.
     
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  2. Bloody_Pete

    Bloody_Pete Technophile

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    You do read the reports about it basically having to not do any pandemic prep for years because if Tory rule and cuts? And about how Singapore having based its response model on ours doing massively better because they actually fund their heath service.
     
  3. RedFlames

    RedFlames ...is not a Belgian football team

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  4. TheBlackSwordsMan

    TheBlackSwordsMan Far over the misty mountains cold

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    I won't post any more pictures of these garbage individuals. It can't get darker and more cold-hearted than this.
    [​IMG]
     
  5. adidan

    adidan Guesswork is still work

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    May I suggest Trump organises some huge MAGA rallies where all the protesters can go and discuss things with him..
     
  6. RedFlames

    RedFlames ...is not a Belgian football team

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  7. adidan

    adidan Guesswork is still work

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    Maybe they should have bought some in 2016 when they were advised to or, now, get back in touch with all those British companies offering to make PPE but who don't get a response back from the Government.
     
  8. RedFlames

    RedFlames ...is not a Belgian football team

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  9. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    Actually it has already been happening. Things that have been privatised in the NHS:

    - Cleaning
    - Catering
    - Portering
    - Estates management and maintenance
    - Ambulance services
    - Visitor and staff car parking
    - Hospice care
    - District nursing (in some parts of the country)
    - Health visitors (in some parts of the country)
    - Community and inpatient mental health services (partially)
    - Learning Disabilities inpatient services (partially)
    - Alcohol services (partially)

    We are talking about 20%. Although the proportion has been relatively stable over the last decade, there has undeniably been an expressed political desire by mainly the Conservatives to get rid of the NHS wholesale since at least the 90's. Just like leaving the EU was seen as the pipe dream of some swivel-eyed fringe politicians in 1997 and now lo, the UK has Brexited, I think that getting rid of the NHS has been a long-term project inexorably moving towards a referendum. And we know how against common sense expectation the EU Referendum turned out.

    But I will have retired by that time and will be long gone from the UK, so it won't be my problem to live with.
     
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  10. fix-the-spade

    fix-the-spade Well-Known Member

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    Don't forget all eyecare services beyond emergency surgery. In fact someone who comes to see my lot then gets referred for a cataract will probably have the whole thing done without ever setting foot in a NHS practice, all on the taxpayer's wallet too. Or they can wait for my local hospital to have a slot, six months to a year after their vision drops below the standard for partial sight.

    It's something that frequently engrages me, the destruction of the NHS isn't being publicised but it is slowly being starved of money and what were originally billed as 'overflow' outsourcing to private services are becoming the norm. I imagine that asking why the seven figure bills getting paid out to these contractors couldn't be added to the original budget instead would be met with deathly silence.

    Also Dentistry, when my Grandfather retired in 1990 he reckoned there would be no NHS dental services by 2000. He wasn't quite right but he was close.

    The Remain campaign never managed to get particularly nasty, if a no NHS vote ever comes along I expect that lesson to have been learned. Or more accurately I expect campaigners for the pro-cuts side to get beaten by angry mobs.
     
  11. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    I think that the alternative to the NHS will be suggested to be some utopian Bismarckian system like France or Germany but even better (because British!). But it will, of course, never be defined; it will just remain a hazy bunch of unrealistic and mutually contradictory promises that everybody can project their own desires on (Sound familiar?). It will be presented as fair, with fat smokers, rich people and above all foreigners paying their way, and giving people total choice and control. And people will tick the box: "Yes! Let's get rid of that archaic, outdated NHS! Let's have a shiny new system whatever that is!"

    How can you compete with an utter fantasy? Realism will always fall short. But after NHSexit day, the reality will inevitably assert itself: in a hideously expensive, lumberingly bureaucratic private healthcare system delivered by mainly American companies courtesy of the new post-Brexit US-UK trade agreement. It's why US-UK is pronounced "U Sucka" in the US.
     
    Last edited: 21 Apr 2020
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  12. walle

    walle Well-Known Member

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    This is what happens when government stoke fear and shut down the country with people freaking out which is more contagious than the actual virus.
    Worth taking into consideration is that 10 million people are out of work, which doesn't help the situation at all.

    As for the lady calling for natural selection I can understand why someone would recoil at that, but, it's better with people with signs in the streets than civil unrest, or worse.
     
  13. Broadwater06

    Broadwater06 Member

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    They're the very same people that don't believe in government handouts as they call it, it's all too 'commie' for them, hence they want work or a haircut.
     
  14. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    Because 11 million people dying messily and hospitals being unable to cope won't freak people out at all.
     
    Last edited: 22 Apr 2020
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  15. liratheal

    liratheal Sharing is Caring

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    Honestly, it makes me think of one of Heath Ledger's Joker monologues

    "Nobody panics when things go according to plan, even if the plan is horrifying."

    COVID-19 is horrifying, and although it's not a plan, it's definitely accepted that it's going to kill a lot of people. Couple that with people not thinking that statistics mean **** to the individual, an orange stain riling them up instead of calming them down..
     
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  16. VipersGratitude

    VipersGratitude Well-Known Member

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  17. RedFlames

    RedFlames ...is not a Belgian football team

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  18. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    Well, it is a city of gamblers, after all...
     
  19. TheBlackSwordsMan

    TheBlackSwordsMan Far over the misty mountains cold

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    Meanwhile in Texas...

    (Gov. Dan Patrick)
    [​IMG]
     
  20. RedFlames

    RedFlames ...is not a Belgian football team

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    Some typical NY reservedness on display -
     
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