1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Gaming The Rules of Game Design

Discussion in 'Article Discussion' started by Tim S, 23 Jan 2008.

  1. Tim S

    Tim S OG

    Joined:
    8 Nov 2001
    Posts:
    18,881
    Likes Received:
    78
  2. iwog

    iwog Linux cursed

    Joined:
    14 Jun 2007
    Posts:
    908
    Likes Received:
    34
    Hmmm Black there's a game with major flaws. You'd think that you'd jest get to go around killing terrorists and the such but its actually a whole web of intrigue which my house mate (who's completed it) and myself never got. Used to end up doing my washing up during the cut scenes and loads on the PS2 version.

    Felt more like work then a game especially with the 90+ minute levels on the first run through and the fact you could suicide right at the end of the game after killing the final boss guy thing. Add in making you restart the 90+ min level all over again if you got frustrated and dared to turn the console off, yes there were checkpoints but they dont save between instances. Was a laugh for the first couple of levels I played.

    Who knew using a shotgun to blow a door off its hinges in the first minute could motivate someone to play a game for the better part of 3 hours.
     
  3. willyolio

    willyolio New Member

    Joined:
    17 Feb 2007
    Posts:
    205
    Likes Received:
    11
    Kingdom hearts. one major aggravating moment i had was near the beginning. first, i picked the "expert" difficulty, thinking the game wouldn't be that hard. it wasn't, for the most part.

    secondly, i decided to explore. i went to tarzan's world before i was supposed to. whoops.

    mandatory landing sequence.

    autosave right before the boss.

    unskippable cutscene right before the boss.

    boss is too hard for me to beat (on my first 8 tries, anyway.)

    now THAT was annoying.
     
  4. DougEdey

    DougEdey I pwn all your storage

    Joined:
    5 Jul 2005
    Posts:
    13,933
    Likes Received:
    33
    Halo 3 save system: What the hell are you smoking? There's autosave checkpoints that reload automatically when you goto "Continue campaign" on the main screen. There's "Reload last checkpoint" and so on. The missions aren't particularly long and you can jump between the chapters.
     
  5. Bauul

    Bauul Sir Bongaminge

    Joined:
    7 Apr 2007
    Posts:
    2,173
    Likes Received:
    38
    Nice article, I'd agree with all of the points, although I think you missed a more important one than the "no FMVs" rule, which is simply:

    Don't mix media.

    Whilst no-one would claim a game engine looks like real life, you suspend your disbelief whilst your playing. However, as soon as a game changes media, from in game engines to prerendered sequences or FMVs, it instantly and totally kills any kind of immersion as you are instantly reminded you're playing a game. For the matter, if you can avoid it, try to maintain the media of NPC communication. There is nothing more blatently obvious and immersion destroying than having certain NPCs communicate with spoken words, and other (less important) characters only use text. Either use all text or all words, don't mix them! It reeks of short-sightedness and shallowness in the game. And for the love of god if you're going to have subtitles, make sure they match the spoken words (Stalker I'm looking at you here).

    And of course the most important game rule of all time:

    Style over substance never works
     
  6. antiHero

    antiHero ReliXmas time!

    Joined:
    19 Jan 2005
    Posts:
    2,037
    Likes Received:
    13
    On the topic of difficulty.

    Skate for 360 is horrible in that sense. The first 60% of the game is a stroll down lollipop lane before you hit face first into a brick wall. Its unbelievable hard from one second to the other and i am stuck with missions i think are impossible. Other then that the game is awesome.
     
  7. Freedom

    Freedom Member

    Joined:
    27 Oct 2004
    Posts:
    801
    Likes Received:
    16
    Nice article but C&C would be C&C without the FMV's the scene where cheesy but that was a part of the game. "From God to Kane to Seth" Legendary. The did go a bit too cheesy with the Estien charter in Red alert 2
     
  8. Zurechial

    Zurechial Elitist

    Joined:
    21 Mar 2007
    Posts:
    2,045
    Likes Received:
    99
    I have to disagree there, and I would cite the Max Payne series as a good example as to why style over substance can work very well when properly applied.

    -

    Joe, I think the reference to Thief: The Dark Age should actually be to Thief: The Dark Project ?
    Unless you were going for a witty portmanteau of Thief: The Dark Project and Thief II: The Metal Age to refer to both games as a single entity. :p
     
  9. Thacrudd

    Thacrudd Where's the any key?!?

    Joined:
    27 Oct 2006
    Posts:
    1,216
    Likes Received:
    83
    Rule 3: Communicate goals clearly and immediately:
    Anyone remember the original Legend of Zelda or Metroid? lol I had no idea what I was doing and still played them for hours.
    I found Crysis to be quite buggy. It was alot of little things but nothing too major.
     
  10. MonkeyNutZ

    MonkeyNutZ Crysis Fiend

    Joined:
    5 Jun 2007
    Posts:
    150
    Likes Received:
    0
    Very nice, with the addition of one new rule, "all new games must have explosive barrels, no matter how unrealistic they may be."
     
  11. completemadness

    completemadness New Member

    Joined:
    11 May 2007
    Posts:
    887
    Likes Received:
    0
    Not sure i agree with all the points you made, but in general, spot on :)
     
  12. g3n3tiX

    g3n3tiX Active Member

    Joined:
    3 Jun 2006
    Posts:
    719
    Likes Received:
    26
    Great article, as always !
    Lots of Valve games in these lists...
     
  13. Keivz

    Keivz New Member

    Joined:
    23 Jan 2008
    Posts:
    11
    Likes Received:
    0
    Well done. Though you left out my most important rule: Don't leave out features that were previously present (e.g. features left out in a sequel) or SHOULD be present (i.e. standard features).

    Prime example: Replays. EA racing games for some reason have been missing this standard feature that was previously present. This enrages me!!!

    Oh, and one more: if it makes sense to have a custom soundtrack, include a custom soundtrack. This should be very easy on PC games, though it seems as if game designers go to great lengths to prevent customization of soundtracks (e.g. proprietary or hidden music files). A custom soundtrack option can make a good game into a great game (or for me, a rental into a purchase).

    Keivz
    P.S.
    NFS:MW also had decent, albeit campy, use FMVs.
     
  14. Firehed

    Firehed Why not? I own a domain to match.

    Joined:
    15 Feb 2004
    Posts:
    12,574
    Likes Received:
    16
    Nah, the autosave systems are always bad compared to a quicksave/quickload system. Even in the first level, I'd autosave just before an unskippable cutscene (oh-ho!), albeit a short one, get my ass kicked, and promptly watch the thing again. Now the first level was the only one I played through on my own as I did the rest on co-op (and playing with someone good helped out quite a bit), but it's just an awkward system. For one, you know a major battle is coming up, and at least half the time it always seems to stick you in a very inopportune situation. Blah.

    Generally speaking, agreed on all ten points. Some games have used FMVs effectively, but plenty more have overdone the thing and ruined it.
     
  15. Woodstock

    Woodstock So Say We All

    Joined:
    10 Sep 2006
    Posts:
    1,783
    Likes Received:
    2
    never make enemy re spawn when you leave the map and come back again, its annoying as hell
     
  16. Multiplectic

    Multiplectic His Stigness

    Joined:
    4 Sep 2007
    Posts:
    372
    Likes Received:
    12
    I think LoTR: The Return of the King had good use of FMVs. Albeit unskippable, they were well implemented.
     
  17. willyolio

    willyolio New Member

    Joined:
    17 Feb 2007
    Posts:
    205
    Likes Received:
    11
    that depends on the game you're playing. it's annoying when they DON'T do that in an RPG, especially when i want to level up.
     
  18. Woodstock

    Woodstock So Say We All

    Joined:
    10 Sep 2006
    Posts:
    1,783
    Likes Received:
    2
    i find it annoying in an rpg as its generally all the low level crap that's respawning
     
  19. CardJoe

    CardJoe Freelance Journalist

    Joined:
    3 Apr 2007
    Posts:
    11,343
    Likes Received:
    292
    In some games though, like System Shock 2 or No One Wants To Live Forever 2, that makes sense. In SS2 it makes things scarier and makes the ship more populated. In NOLF2 enemies respawn from certain points and pour back into the level again if you set an alarm off: reinforcements.
     
  20. Bauul

    Bauul Sir Bongaminge

    Joined:
    7 Apr 2007
    Posts:
    2,173
    Likes Received:
    38
    Come on, Max Payne was hardly void of substance. I'd say Max Payne is a good example of a game that matched style and substance perfectly. Whilst a lot of effort went into the noir feel of the game and the much-touted bullet time, it did actually add a huge amount to the gameplay and really made the game as good as it was. Something like Doom 3, however, was really too much style over substance.

    N'ah, I'm with Woodstock on this one, infinitely respawning enemies are the scurge of many a good games. Setting off an alarm and thus spawning enemies is fine, as you can avoid it, but just having them endlessly appear out of nowhere to add 'tension' (read annoyance) just sucks ass. It's one of the major flaws of SS2 in my opinion. What they should have done, instead of endlessly respawning zombies, was have the zombies stunable, but essentially unkillable, so you'd 'kill' them, they'd fall down, but five or ten minutes later (after you'd long since left the room) gotten back up again. All the fear of a repsawning enemies system, with none of the immersion killing, game breaking, ****-baggness that having actual respawning enemies result in.
     
Tags: Add Tags

Share This Page