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Education Using bicycle helmet cameras?

Discussion in 'General' started by bigsharn, 29 Oct 2011.

  1. identikit

    identikit Active Member

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    @Bigsharn if you're going to remove comments from your youtube channel please remove the video of your "motorpacing" behind a bendy bus. Cheers.
     
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  2. sp4nky

    sp4nky BF3: Aardfrith WoT: McGubbins

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    Using a head camera and posting the videos online means you should be more wary than the average road user. You're effectively giving evidence of any personal wrong-doings.

    Having watched some of your videos, I think you should be prosecuted for some of those incidents. Riding on the wrong side of the road, making it difficult for a bus to pass you safely? I think that's dangerous and then you have the temerity to complain about someone else not signalling. Did you actually signal at that junction and did you look behind before turning? It seemed as though you just sat in the vehicle's blind spot and wanted to be knocked down.

    Then you openly admit jumping traffic lights and you refuse to use cycle lanes when they are provided. What does the Highway Code say about those things?
     
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  3. identikit

    identikit Active Member

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    If you bothered to do any research you'd find the Highway code states

    http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAndTransport/Highwaycode/DG_069837

    Jumping traffic lights is, of course, illegal.
     
  4. MarkW7

    MarkW7 Total Noob

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    Clothing. You should wear

    • Bright pink helmet
    [​IMG]

    :hehe::hehe::worried:
     
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  5. Malvolio

    Malvolio .

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    Two things about me are not very secret around here: I'm an avid cyclist, and not one to hold my mouth about it. So let me relate a few things to you from a bicycle wrench with more than a decade of experience, and somebody who, at 26, has never held a license for a motor vehicle (well, beyond a learners anyway) by choice.

    First thing I must say is that most cyclists are crap. Absolutely rubbish at piloting their chosen method of movement. I've had to more often than I wish to relate jump into a ditch whilst riding along a pathway because some cyclist coming the other way doesn't realise which lane they should be in. There have even been multiple occasions wherein I've been forced to jump into motorised traffic as it was safer than being on the pathway with other cyclists. So please don't assume I hold some false idea of the general proficiency of cyclists.

    However, this doesn't absolve the general motorist of just how poorly they pilot their three thousand pound, couple hundred horsepower method of conveyance. Yes, cyclists can be terrible at moving along in a straight line, but in an interaction between a cyclist and a motorist, whom do you think will come off worst, in every instance? By no means do I disagree with the idea of every cyclist that wishes to be on the road having registration, insurance, and a number plate plastered to their back-side, but I do feel that cyclists make up for this with their lives. If we don't take due diligence of our surroundings, and of the other users of the road, then we pay for our mistakes with our lives, not just some scratching and denting on our vehicle (with some slight personal injury - like whiplash, or a broken nail). I feel I must also point out that in most cities that have a high number of cycle messengers, this group is generally forced to register, get insured, and display a number plate. Despite this, they're generally looked at as pure scum of the earth, more akin to a parasite than a vehicle. Thus the idea of cyclists getting a plate bolted to their bottoms helping "equality" has about as much veracity as letting the church handle priestly paedophiles itself, as we all know how well that is working out...

    More than a few times I've heard within this thread that cyclists shouldn't expect more than two-feet of room off their side, as otherwise they're "asking for the world". Here is a question: whilst at the wheel of a motor vehicle, do you generally give just two-feet of room between your three-thousand pound vehicle and the next, or do you opt for more, just in case the other driver moves a little bit, causing a collision? Realise that cyclists, whilst travelling at speeds greater than a crawl, will require manoeuvre room, just as any other vehicle might, due to imperfections in the road. Even then, we're particularly vulnerable to road hazards seeing as the pot-hole that you barely notice could cause catastrophic failure of our vehicle, or total loss of control to the inexperienced and skilled alike. So when you decide to pass me close enough for my unzipped jacket to clip your wing-mirror (which is a quite common event, let me assure you), realise that you've taken my life in your hands with only the slightest of margins.

    There have also been questions raised about how one would ever live without their motor vehicle, which I can only assume come from a position of ignorance or arrogance. Why? Well my commute would be about a half hour longer by car (if I decided to leave two hours before rush hour), my monthly cost of living would go up drastically (meaning I wouldn't be able to afford the things I can, or enjoy life as I do), and my physical fitness would go well down (as I wouldn't have a built in ten hours of weekly exercise). If obtaining physical possessions is of question, then I can only point out that just the other month I was easily able to tow home nearly 150lbs of furniture with my two-wheeled vehicle of choice via a cheaply purchased tow-along trailer, over nearly a 15km route with quite a steep hill. I don't feel as though two weeks of groceries would be much of an issue (but then again I question the logic of stock-piling like that, but such issues are for another discussion). By no means do I mean this to be a thorough "everybody should cycle now, without question" argument, but rather a demonstration that one need not suffer without motorised transport, and an argument with a question: have you tried not driving for a month?

    Insofar as I am concerned, there is very little place within a city for the motor vehicle (beyond mass transport of people/goods), but I realise that not everybody is as open-minded to accept such a drastic change in their life, nor are they willing to even explore the option. So I accept that whilst sharing road space with motor vehicles I have to always be on guard, riding both defensively and offensively, watching to make sure that the other vehicles aren't overtly putting my life at risk, and that I will always be viewed as a second-class citizen because I've chosen to eschew a method of personal transport that - to my mind - makes no sense whatsoever within the context of commuting intracity. Every moment that I chose to ride upon the same surface that three thousand pound vehicles occupy, my life could be taken without much warning.

    Melodramatic? Yes, but considering the very small percentage of cyclists that occupy the road, there are quite a lot of deaths. I must also note that it is really difficult to find a good, reliable statistic like that.

    Anyway, in such regard as what I've just put forth I do wholeheartedly endorse the idea of helmet cameras for your daily, on both sides (not that I feel there really should be much division between the two groups, other than for safetys sake). Though it must be said that posting the foibles of motor vehicles to a public forum is quite a childish act, no matter the context, and I personally would rather see footage of illegal road activity taken directly to the police for enforcement.
     
  6. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead It's big, and it's clever.

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    The bike will come of worse... every time. Which makes me wonder why they chose to jump red lights, squeeze in between lanes of traffic with inches to spare, and exit cycle lanes without looking, or signalling. Knowing that they are so vulnerable, you'd think they'd pay more attention. What usually happens though, is they'll just exit cycle lanes and expect the motorist to afford them room. You can't always do that, and it's often very dangerous to just slam the brakes on because a cyclist has decided to leave the cycle lane and join the main carriageway. For such vulnerable road users, you certainly take risks.

    Not you personally.. I've no idea how you ride. I'm just relaying my experience. Most cyclists have no idea how little room you have to manoeuvre a car in a city environment.



    I disagree. Just because you are at risk, doesn't absolve you from having to obey the same rules, and being regulated in the same way... or it shouldn't rather. Motor cyclists are at far more risk then car drivers too, but they also have to obey the same laws and regulations. We make no concessions for them, so why should we for cyclists? Just because you don't have an engine? In a city, you're probably the fastest moving vehicle around!

    The fact that they are looked upon as scum is generally due to their behaviour, not because they are a cyclist. The fact is though, for most cyclists, the respect is one way. They show zero respect for car drivers, yet they are confrontational and militant about car drivers showing them respect. This seems to be the de facto attitude. Cyclists need educating on the difficulties a car driver faces in a city. If you pull out on me, I will have nowhere to go, as there will be traffic in the other lane.. and usually I can't just slam on either, because they're something right up my ass... usually another cyclist!

    In a suburban or rural setting, I'd leave a door's width when passing another vehicle, and if I can't, I'll slow down. In city traffic though, that's not possible, and yes, I'll often be around 2 to 3 ft from the vehicle next to me, even while moving. That's how tight it is, and this is why I can't suddenly deviate my course to avoid you.


    With all due respect, that's YOUR problem.. literally, because in a city environment, there's usually nowhere for me to go to get out of your way should you swerve, or fall off. Literally.. nothing I can do except brake. As I said above, you're often less than 30 inches from the vehicle in the lane next to you. If the road is is such a state that a cyclist can not cycle in a straight line on it, then it's incumbent upon the cyclist to dismount so far as I'm concerned. Feel free to complain and get the road repaired, but until it is, understand that if you're a few feet from a car, that in turn is a few feet from another car... no one has anywhere to go.

    We don't drive close to you out of lack of respect. There's just no room to give you more room. If there is, I do, always. I am well aware of the needs of cyclists, and on the open road I'll always give metres of room, especially at speed as I'm aware of the wind my passing will cause. City streets are a different matter though.

    You see... this is what pi$$es people off most about cyclists. The evangelistic, righteousness of them. Look mate... My drive to work involves 17 miles of fast A road with a 60mph limit. I can clear that stretch of road in around 15-17 minutes in my car. Assuming I could average 15mph on my bike, it would take over an hour. Don't assume that everyone's commute is being stuck in traffic... it's not.

    Your commute would be longer by car, good for you. Mine wouldn't.

    Yes bikes can tow trailers to carry stuff. Yes, they keep you fit. I know all this, but what about those that can't due to illness, weakness, infirmity, disability, or just age. You expect my 74 year old mum to tow her shopping back from Sainsbury's on a bike?

    What if it's raining? I then have to start messing around with trying to get a waterproof covering on my trailer to stop my stuff getting ruined.

    It's just not a practical solution all the time. I didn't create a society where people work miles away from their homes, or where supermarkets on the edge of town have replaced the local grocer's store. This isn't my fault, but I do have to live like this. Being preached at by cyclists in that sanctimonious way they have just irritates. Do you think I WANT to pay thousands of pounds per year to drive to work in a Nissan Micra? If there was a bus that departed from near enough to my house to walk to it, and arrive near enough to walk to work, I'd do it. I did just this in London every day.

    When I drive my Mustang, that's for pleasure, and it serves no purpose, but last time I checked, that's not illegal... yet.

    Boll0x. When I lived in London I didn't have a car. I agree with you on this, but you'll always have traffic on city streets, as there will always be taxis, and buses and delivery vehicles, and dispatch riders etc. However, don't tar me with the same brush as the knobs that drive around London in Range Rovers and Q7s please.

    Well, I can't speak for others, but yes, I do see cyclists as second class road users, but not in a way that makes me behave so as to risk their lives. I'm a very conscientious driver. I worked as a driving instructor for years. I understand. However... again, not referring to you personally, but most cyclists attitudes stink! I seriously think the issue is lack of culpability. They know they're anonymous, unidentifiable, and they know there's little recourse for the motorist should they damage a vehicle. They don't care basically. They're damned confrontational as well. Not only to car drivers, but to other cyclists! I have ridden bikes in cities, and being a car driver mainly, wasn't aware of the "rules" cyclists ride to. Here's me in my innocent ways thinking ALL road users obey the highway code.. LOL. I stopped at a red light in a cycle lane. Guess what happened next :) A BARRAGE of abuse from the cyclists who fully expect to be able to ride through red lights!

    Is this the behaviour of squishy, vulnerable people being terrorised by the big bad car? No, it's a bunch of people with no respect for the needs and hazards of car drivers, and zero respect for the rules of the road.


    Nothing wrong with helmet cams if it can help resolve a conflict, or help prosecute someone for braking the law. Most of these videos I've seen though show the cyclist almost willingly creating a conflict in order to make a point. Most head cam vidoes are not helping your cause.

    Things like this..

    http://www.youtube.com/user/Bigsharnm#p/a/2D1A74822A5FCD9B/2/pKabVkNY-b4


    That was the cyclists fault. The oncoming traffic had already moved over to pass stationary traffic on their side of the road, and were already in position and committed BEFORE the cyclist approached the parked vehicle on HIS side of the road. The Highway Code states that it is incumbent on the cyclist to wait until the oncoming traffic has cleared the obstruction. In this video however, the cyclist just steams on in despite this, then blames the oncoming traffic. Where did he expect them to go? Did he expect them to stop for him? if so, why? The rules state that the cyclist should have waited for the narrow section to be clear.. because they were their first!

    This just shows how cyclists are ignorant of the rules of the road usually, and given a head cam, start acting as if it's their mission to expose car drivers. Because of this they seem to willingly provoke conflict. All he had to do there was wait for the traffic to pass, exactly as he would have to if he was driving a car. Just because a bike is small enough to squeeze through a gap doesn't mean you should, and it certainly doesn't mean you have a right to complain if you break the rules and put yourself in danger.
     
    Last edited: 30 Oct 2011
  7. mvagusta

    mvagusta Did a skid that went for two weeks.

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    I think helmet cam is a good idea... perhaps it should be mandatory for all vehicles on the road!

    I'm sure people will drive much more responsibly, when they know that should they cause an accident, they will most likely be easily proven at fault on at least one camera... but come to think of it, there would probably be much more people driving like even bigger hoons, with the intention of uploading the video they just recorded to youtube or whatever.

    Oh well, still a good idea to whack a camera on your helmet, assuming you won't be using it for recording epic riding skilz in traffic. Most bicyclists ride very well... or perhaps I should say that most female cyclists ride very well, but most of the guys I see riding, and some of the girls, ignore all road rules, will squeeze anywhere and in any direction they can, even if that means riding on the wrong side of the road, or cutting off people on footpaths, anything goes, and to top it off, many of these reckless riders will shout abuse at anyone who gets in their way :confused:

    One of these reckless riders once bumped into my previous car! I pulled over, got out, abused the crap out of the dimwit and checked my car for damage. Luckily for him there was none, so I told him where to go.
    Later on that day, I get a call from the cops! So I told them what happened, and when the cyclists confirmed my story, the cops fined the cyclist :lol: I can't believe the guy was sooo stupid, that he actually believed he could just sail straight through a busy/slow intersection, and everyone currently in the intersection had to give way to him :duh:

    Perhaps the government need to enforce license requirements for cyclists. Regulations like this are necessary in a world filled with stupid people.
     
  8. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead It's big, and it's clever.

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    I think if everyone had one, then it might work, but as it is, it is there for protection should you need evidence in a claim, or criminal act. These people who actively seem to go looking for trouble, just to post on youtube are creating problems, not solving them.
     
  9. Toka

    Toka Member

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    All I want to happen when I'm cycling is for drivers to be aware of me, aware of my speed and to not put my life at unnecessary risk. In return I don't ride like a ****** and am conscientious toward other road users.

    I attempt to spread good karma by giving a thumbs up and a thank you when drivers see me and do something right. I express my displeasure when they do something wrong.

    I ride a couple hundred miles a week in winter and generally most drivers aren't too bad. A minority do suck and need to wake the **** up. An even smaller minority are actively dangerous and these drivers I do attempt an exchange of views with.
     
  10. mvagusta

    mvagusta Did a skid that went for two weeks.

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    I had a look at some of your videos bigsharn.... and OMG :eeek: Are you insane? :eyebrow:

    You seem to think that you own the roads, or that every other road user needs to GTFO of your way, as if you are royalty or something :confused:

    If someone stops, you insult them, people are apparently not allowed to block your way :confused: It also seems that once you pass a car, they are not allowed to pass you :eyebrow:
    If I am incorrect, then I'd love to read an explanation, about what the red car did wrong, the two times you complained in this video:

    :confused: :worried: Do you think you can tailgate, in a car's blind spot, and that means the car is not allowed to slow down or turn? Do you think the red car should stop and let you pass, because you are tailgating them? Oh wait, is it because you passed them for a moment, so they must stay behind you! No car is ever allowed to overtake you, correct?

    Or if someone dares to overtake without giving you over 1 meter of clearance, you insult them :eyebrow:

    I'd say their overtake was very calm, you really can't tell who is the pointlessly aggressive one in these videos? :eyebrow:

    You seem more than happy however, to tail gate and overtake anyone, whilst being as close as you can get, and you even do this whilst being on the wrong side of the road:


    The only option you seem to be happy with, is if other road users stay of the roads completely.

    PROTIP: With an attitude like that, only bad things will happen :duh:
     
  11. bigsharn

    bigsharn Officially demotivated

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    About the last time I saw a car be prosecuted for not using their indicators

    Yes, I am

    I think that's a debate for another topic to be honest


    I never gave cars a second thought at 17, it's only at 20 that I've started thinking about passing my test for a wider range of job prospects.

    As I mentioned before, there are plenty of cyclists that have been prosecuted for dangerous cycling or causing harm and/or injury to others.

    I've never once mentioned that in this topic, in fact I am against segregating cars and bicycles, because there'll never be a cycle lane on every road, and when drivers come across a cyclist they'll be less experienced in how to handle an overtaking maneuver.

    I want people to overtake safely. It's not like I'm asking folk to ALWAYS use the furthest right hand lane to pass me, but at least to make an effort to give me a bit more room than they would a parked car, for example.

    A bit of an unfair generalisation there.


    The CTC has over 50,000 members, the London Cycle Campaign has over 11,000 members and British Cycling has over 40,000 members, all of which are cycling clubs that offer free third party insurance when you sign up.

    Again, an unfair anti-cyclist generalisation there.


    There are plenty of cyclists that do wait at red lights. Many people that use bikes take the same route day in day out, so they're easy enough to identify if you go back the next day at about the same time. Besides, people are on an average of 300 CCTV cameras a day, surely one of them has to get a clear picture of that cyclist that just scratched your car?

    I never said it'll cost ME money, I said it'll cost money that the government doesn't have, which will then be footed by the taxpayers and will then be another case of "I pay for your existance on the road", as you displayed earlier with the Road Tax argument.


    Well that's fair enough... But there are plenty of (just as an example) Chelsea tractors being used for what would be a 15-30 minute walk. It's plenty plausible for the majority of people that use their cars to get around, just laziness takes over.

    Cycle panniers. I regularly bring home 4 bags of shoping in my bike bags.

    Because there's no reason that cycling should cost any more money than it already does.


    So why should it be any different in a city environment than it is on a country road? We don't NEED cycle lanes (as above) and I admit that not every cyclist is kosher, but the ones that wear helmet cameras (Just a gentle reminder, this IS what the topic's about) are, and realise this.

    A) The majority of cyclists that have cameras on their head ARE co-operative in a situation like that.
    B) As above
    C) So you reckon that recalling the ~10 million bikes out there, registering them and making insurance mandatory would

    ...Correction, IF they're caught. I've had a close pass from an uninsured driver before now (you can check the legality of the car by the reg plate and make), who the police weren't even aware was on the road when I reported them. (No video of that incident)
     
  12. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead It's big, and it's clever.

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    What the hell did this car do wrong? LOL. YOU were in the wrong, and if you don't understand why then you've no business being allowed on a public road!






    And here? They aren't overtaking on the inside. YOU decided to ride past a column of slow moving traffic. It started moving faster, leaving you stranded by the white line. How is that the motorist's fault? Why not signal left and move back over instead of accusing everyone of undertaking you. Did you expect to stay where you were and have all the traffic obediently drive no faster than you can cycle?
     
    Last edited: 30 Oct 2011
  13. bigsharn

    bigsharn Officially demotivated

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    Sorry, I mistook you for some random troll. Post the comment again and I'll happily reply.

    Link me to the videos that you're on about and I'll happily give an explaination

    I've never jumped a red, I've maybe gone through amber a few times a bit late and misread the road ahead. And as above, cycle lane use is NOT compulsory.

    Thank you for (albeit evetually :p) sticking to the topic. Rather than adding to the police's workload, I ask a fair few people in these videos to search for their numberplate on Youtube. Many see the error of what they've done, but granted there are a few that go ape at the idea of a mere cyclist telling them how to ride

    The majority of us only ask that you give us as much room as passing a car. As Malvolio was saying, a soft bit of flesh damages a lot more easily than the car that's also 3ft away from you.


    Which you should do, as you would wait for a motorcyclist or a car that's broken down in the middle of the road (which is the closest equivalent to falling off there is for a motor vehicle).


    Or just cover the trailer before you leave (as iirc you legally have to to stop things blowing out.) or use water proof panniers?


    And if they were wearing cameras, they wouldn't be doing this.


    And I agreed to that in the description. I made a booboo and admitted that. Had I waited to overtake the parked car on my side I'd have been just to the offside of the vehicle and would have still had less room than the parked car on the other side.

    Good story, about how a cyclist managed to get prosecuted for a Road Traffic Collision


    Exactly how I feel, but what's your opinion on using a camera?

    If you read the description, the first annoyance I have is with a car tailgating me that I'd had problemks with further up the road. The second time I got annoyed because she never checked her mirrors before or during turning.

    If someone overtakes me with <1m of clearance I get annoyed because that's too close to be passed at that speed. As I mentioned earlier, cyclists could easily **** a pothole and need room to correct their line. I'm assuming from your username you ride a motorbike, so you know exactly what I mean as regards to dodgy road surfaces.
    If you'd heard the aggressive revving (seriously, turn your speakers up, I aren't making it up) you'd understand why I labelled it an aggressive pass

    Tailgating I admit to, but it takes a lot less road for me to stop at 30mph than it does a car (thank you, law of momentum). On that video I was overtaking on the outside of traffic (as I'm sure motorcyclists do as well) and keeping my options open for rejoining the traffic flow so I didn't end up hitting someone head-on.

    "If you read the description, the first annoyance I have is with a car tailgating me that I'd had problemks with further up the road. The second time I got annoyed because she never checked her mirrors before or during turning."

    Now... can we PLEASE get back to the topic in hand and stop with the anti-cyclist remarks? (not aimed at anyone in particular)
     
  14. sp4nky

    sp4nky BF3: Aardfrith WoT: McGubbins

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    How about this one:


    Have a look at the traffic light at 0:23. It turns to red before you pass it. Have a look at the road at that point. The bus, which is in front of you, is straddling the pedestrian crossing and its back wheel is behind the stop line for bikes.

    Never jumped a red?
     
  15. Malvolio

    Malvolio .

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    Bigsharn, I promise topic soon, but I do want to spend some time with a few replies to my earlier post. :)

    I agree fully, hence why in my earlier posting I stated quite clearly that I personally feel most cyclists do not pay due attention, despite the dangers being so much more real to them.


    Two things: I never stated that cyclists shouldn't have to follow the regulations of the road by any measure. Rather I feel that cyclists should be burdened with more responsibility in following the rules due to the thin margin that they exist within whilst riding. And secondly, why is it such an issue to put the stoppers on? Throughout your post you make it sound as though applying the brakes on your car is tantamount to baby killing, and that under no circumstances should another road user cause you to slow down. I'll come right out and say that I don't understand that mentality: if somebody tailgates you because they were too busy admiring your bumper stickers and ignoring regulations on proper following distance, then surely it is the fault of the other driver and not the person in front of you, no?


    So why would you figure that cyclists have so much more room? If a cyclist feels safe enough to brush elbow to mirror, then slow down and try your best not to swerve into their way, but don't put them at such risk if you've another option. It is a two way street, and if the cyclist cannot understand that you can't always move at the drop of a hat, then it is truly their problem, not yours.


    Bit of a tangent, but I feel one that is appropriate: why do you always feel the need to pass cyclists? Why is it necessary to drive at or above the posted speed limit? For the year that I spent driving I never saw any need whatsoever to exceed the legal speed limit - rather I tended to keep under it as courtesy to other motorists, and give me room to accelerate and manoeuvre with greater control around obstacles.


    Great, I'm glad you actually took time to read my post. :) However, I would like to point out that I specifically said that it isn't for everybody, and that motor vehicles within city limits for personal use only don't have much point. Your commute doesn't seem to be restricted to within city limits. Ergo: your commute benefits from, and makes sense only with personalised motor vehicular transport. Though I do wonder why one would feel the need to live so far away from where they work - surely it would be cheaper or easier to live closer?


    Once again, thanks for reading my post before you responded to it. :) I fully agree that vehicles for commercial use are absolutely necessary intracity, and there is absolutely no getting around it no matter what you do. Most of the time these professional road users aren't too bad at their appointed task (except taxis, obviously), as they're expected to drive to a better standard than the average motorist.


    And I don't contend this point! I must point out once again that most cyclists suck. More than a few times whilst stopped at a light I've seen a few of my two-wheeled brethren go flying through, so I've hurled a few not-so-polite words at them. It isn't uncommon for me to lecture other cyclists on various other matters of road safety as well.


    Again: I agree. Quoting myself from earlier Anyway, in such regard as what I've just put forth I do wholeheartedly endorse the idea of helmet cameras for your daily, on both sides (not that I feel there really should be much division between the two groups, other than for safetys sake). Though it must be said that posting the foibles of motor vehicles to a public forum is quite a childish act, no matter the context, and I personally would rather see footage of illegal road activity taken directly to the police for enforcement.

    You've claimed multiple times within this thread that cyclists are viewing the issue through rose tinted glasses, only seeing one side of the argument, but I put forth that you're wholesale ignoring parts of the argument that you either cannot easily dismiss, or don't have an answer to. Most everything you've said in reply to my comment I already had addressed. I'm sure you're not a terrible driver, but I do question your quite obvious bias towards the motor vehicle.
     
  16. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead It's big, and it's clever.

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    I leave what space I can. That is not for me to decide in most city streets. It's dictated by how close the car is in the other lane. It's beyond my control. If there's a cycle lane, then there shouldn't be a problem, but if there isn't, there's really nothing I can do sometimes.


    Are you suggesting I drive over cyclists if they fall off? LOL. Of course not, but if there is no room to move right, all I can do is brake. I will either stop in time, or I won't. Physics dictates that, not I. If cyclists insist on undertaking and just appearing out of nowhere, I can't even do anything to maintain a safe stopping distance.

    I do not wish to go grocery shopping in a bicycle. You will never sell the idea to me. Ever.

    Perhaps not... but then again, perhaps yes. You run a red light on one of your videos ;)








    LOL. You almost undertake her on the inside, then tailgate her right up to the junction... what is she supposed to do, stop and let you pass on the inside? She was INDICATING.. what the hell are you doing so close to a car you KNOW is going to turn left? Sorry mate, but you are clear wrong. She did absolutely nothing whatsoever wrong. She was not obliged to let you pass or anything. She was clearly indicating left, YOU have to wait for her to turn, or if it's safe to do so, overtake her on her offside. If you were on a motorbike test, you'd have failed for a dangerous fault 3 times within 1 minute. Learn to ride responsibly, because so far as I can tell, you're a terrible cyclist.

    Seriously... have you even read the highway code? It is illegal to undertake, and it is sheer insanity to expect to pass a vehicle signalling left on the inside.

    As for getting back on topic, I fail to see what the issue is. Yes, on the whole, of course it's a great idea if every road user had a camera. My only issue with them is that it turns some people into vigilantes who drive or ride around looking for confrontation, just to have a cool vid to post.
     
    Last edited: 30 Oct 2011
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  17. Picarro

    Picarro New Member

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    I might be very blunt with this post but you seem like a really shitty bicyclist Bigsharn. From your videos it is clear that you have a blatant disregard of even the simplest of traffic rules. It would be no wonder to me if you got hit by a car some day and I feel sorry for the driver who would have mental scarring for years to come.

    This entire thread reeks of bicyclist elitism, Bigsharn for the most part and a bit from Malvolio. I have great respect for Malvolio - he seems like a great dude but bicyclists just have to learn that you are the squishy targets out there and the amount of agility one has in a car is nowhere near the agility you have when riding a bike.

    Please for the love of God, drive sensibly. It might take you 5 minutes longer to get there but at least you don't end up as red goo on the road.

    For the record, I have ridden a bike for 12 years and I have been driving for the past 3 months. The amount of retards on bikes I experience when I am driving in my parents car is astonishing.
     
  18. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead It's big, and it's clever.

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    It's not, but when there's traffic right up your arse, I'm almost literally between a rock and a hard place. Have a collision with something up front, or slam on and get hit from behind.

    The fact is, if everyone left a suitable stopping distance, INCLUDING cyclists, then it wouldn't be an issue.


    If a cyclist chooses to "brush elbow to mirror" then they're being a dickhead! That's far too close. If they chose to do that, then I have do something about it? LOL Sorry.. if you chose to come so close, then it's your look out.

    Who mentioned speeding? Cyclists rarely ride along at 30mph I find, and unless I drive everywhere at 15mph I'm probably going to be passing cyclists. I often drive at less than the posted limit, for 2 reasons. A) Traffic does not allow any greater speed, and B) in built up residential areas. All other time, if visibility of good and traffic allows I will be driving at 30mph.

    If you drive at less on a driving test for no clearly identifiable reason, you will fail for undue hesitancy.


    LOL... WTF? Ok... I'll sell my house at a LOSS thanks to banking crisis... spend 6 months in a chain while I wait for someone to but their house, then spend hundreds moving.... all so I can use a bike? :) I know you want to spread the word an' all that, but you'll never make a cyclist out of me. I'm just too lazy. Sorry.

    No thanks. I have a house already. I can tell by how you're talking you've never bought, sold, or owned property. It ain't that easy to just "move" at the drop of a hat... plus.. I LIKE living where I live. Why should I move? :)


    Why question it? It's my choice to make in a free democratic society. I admit I am HEAVILY biased towards the car. You say that as if it's a crime :) I drive for 2 reasons.

    A) I drive the Micra to get to work, or my 9 hour working day would be a 11 hour working day, and I'd have to spend time getting changed when I get to work, and in summer I'd be sweating and smelly too, which I do not wish to be.

    B) I drive the Mustang because I enjoy it. It's a toy. It serves no purpose other than to entertain me.

    Why would you question my right to do either of those things? I drive responsibly, and it makes no difference to you either way :)


    Exactly. Bigsharn's videos will more likely incriminate him than help him :)
     
    Last edited: 30 Oct 2011
  19. bigsharn

    bigsharn Officially demotivated

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    Just a quote for truth. I was passed by a taxi earlier (no camera footage), I was doing 22 in a 20mph zone* and he still felt a need to pass me.


    It certainly seemed implicit from your post. If a cyclist is wobbling a bit or the road surface isn't the best of condition, hang back so in the event that they do fall off, you're not going to be cleaning guts from your tyres.

    I wasn't trying to sell it to you, merely suggest that it's possible.


    > She overtook me and then slowed. As a cycle lane is a seperate lane of traffic, overtaking there would have been perfectly legal. She accelerated so I braked to drop back behind her.
    > I was indicating, and trying to slot into a position behind her, but the penis in the car behind wasn't letting me out. (hence constantly shoulder checking)
    > She started indicating and I had to force my way in behind her. I was never going to pass her on the inside while she was moving, especially on the run up to a left turning.
    > She didn't start indicating until 3 car lengths before the turning. I had no idea she was turning left until this point.


    That's fair enough, all I was after was an opinion on the topic itself.

    If you go and read Cyclecraft by John Franklin (Government endorsed book) the Cycling Proficiency test follows that book to the letter, and the instructors encourage people to read it at least once if they're going to be using their bike for a decent length of time.

    Really? I could swear that there was a more anti-cyclist vibe in the air...

    Again, cyclists can stop in a MUCH shorter distance than cars can. It only takes a second of space between yourself and the car in front and you won't hit them.

    I have to agree here, if as a cyclist you're passing people with inches to spare there's something seriously wrong with your perception of safety


    There are plenty that do. If you can't get past safely then you should wait until it's safe to pass. You wouldn't pass a tractor on an A road on double white lines so why not extend a cyclist the same courtesy?

    I'm using a tractor as an example because they go roughly half the speed limit on A roads, as cyclists do on urban roads.


    As I said earlier, I'm not the best cyclist in the world, but this isn't a topic about my skill on the road now, is it?
     
    Last edited: 30 Oct 2011
  20. BenK

    BenK Member

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    Perhaps not, but a lot of your grievances seem to stem from it.
     

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