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News Vista is a hardware beast

Discussion in 'Article Discussion' started by WilHarris, 7 Sep 2005.

  1. Firehed

    Firehed Why not? I own a domain to match.

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    I think the clip just sucked, it's not as if I was comparing similar scenes. Still, the only difference I noticed was that it was bigger and more demanding.

    Maybe I need a bigger monitor. Pixels get PRETTY small at 1920x**** on a 19" CRT. Even running my normal 1600x1200, I couldn't tell the difference between my 272i, 480i/p (whatever normal DVDs are), 720p or 1080i clips. Well a slight difference between my 272i and the res, but that's due to a massive re-encoding more than anything else. And whaddya expect shrinking ~6GB of movie into 700MB. I notice much more of the re-encoding artifacting effects on my normal TV, despite the fact that I don't (well, no longer) have digital cable.

    It's probably because I notice aliasing a lot, but video footage really doesn't have it, just like it has motion blur so 24fps can look as smooth at 60fps. Gaming I notice a HUGE difference at different resolutions and AA/AF (moreso on AA) settings.

    Any monitor that can do 1280x720 is "HD ready" (it can show 720p video). Anything that can do 1920x1080 (1080p, though movies will be at 1080i and then have the frequency upsampled to 60hz or whatever you're running at) can run the higher of the two HD resolutions. However AFAIK no display in the States is HDCP-compliant (or compatible or whatever it would be) at this point.

    To me, high-def is just an overmarketed buzzword (or phrase, I suppose). So I guess HDCP won't mean much to me, if all it'll do is downsample HD quality to probably the equivalent of standard DVD when on an non-HDCP compliant display. Still, if you pay four grand or more for a new uber-TV and then Microsoft and the boys in the two HD optical format camps go and tell you that you can't have the best image quality, yer going to be just a bit irked.

    Of course, the concept doesn't really make sense. What the heck does your TV have to do with you using legitimate content? Pirated stuff won't have HDCP protection, much like it doesn't have Macrovision, region coding or u-POPs now.

    Just another way to do absolutely nothing to stop piracy (and encourage it more if anything) and piss off legitimate consumers. Almost as smart as the "if you're using pirated windows, you'll get a discount on your legal purchase" idea.
     
  2. Kipman725

    Kipman725 When did I get a custom title!?!

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    meh I'm never getting vista unless all the crap is stripped out. goodbye gaming...
     
  3. FeRaL

    FeRaL New Member

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    Well spoken and thought out.
     
  4. DivineSin

    DivineSin New Member

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    Why is anyone even argueing about HDCP when its so far off it doesnt even matter right now.

    I want to know why the hell there working on visually improving there system and not improving it for functionality and speed. Why not let the users completly customize the OS, from the processes that run from startup to the icons that display across your computer without having to go through several annoying steps.

    Why not make it so uninstalling a program doesnt leave crap registry and files on your system? Why not get rid of all the stupid little things that hardly anyone uses.

    I could careless how the OS looks, most people use the classic view or there own customized theme. I dont know one person who uses the default themes other than people who dont know how to change them. I would rather have Microsoft spend there time on better GPU, CPU, and RAM utilization.

    These new OS's shouldnt be leaps and bounds in requirements over there previous operating system. If anything, they should be less demanding on the system with better utilization of processes and less crap running in the background that you never use.
     
  5. RTT

    RTT #parp

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  6. shredder109

    shredder109 New Member

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    Check this out: http://www.digitalconnection.com/FAQ/HDTV_12.asp

    This site says "Nearly all consumer video equipment with DVI/HDMI connectors are HDCP compliant including DVD players available on the market today. You can continue to use the component output of these devices without worry of HDCP, but expect the analog connections to slowly disappear from future products."

    However, it also says, "It is important to note that HDCP is currently not a standard used in PC monitors, and almost none of these displays have Component inputs. This fact alone will deter HDTV/DVD to be displayed on a typical LCD/CRT monitor. A clear line has been defined between consumer entertainment vs. PC/Commercial product. "...
     
  7. specofdust

    specofdust Banned

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    I don't see that this is too much bad news. For a start I don't think we'll see it as early as they say we will. Even so though, XP support probably won't be stopped for a good few years, maybe '09 or '10. HDCP content has already been cracked, this is just going to drive more people to the shady world of cracks and hacks, that's all. The requirements seem huge, maybe too much, but then, say it comes out in mid 2007, that's a long time away, think on the average PC 2 years ago?
     
  8. Geldon

    Geldon New Member

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    Honestly, I can't stand movie theaters anymore, the quality sucks, the sound is worse, the popcorn is unaffordable and little Jimmy is crying through the second half. Watching a DVD on my big screen at home is cheaper, looks better, sounds better, and, thanks to Blockbuster by mail, doesn't require me to spend $40 in gas to drive to the theater.

    I paid over $1500 for my home theater setup, I am NOT going to pay another $1500 so that I can watch new movies; I would sooner stop buying new movies. The problem becomes that the MPAA will start blaming “the shady world of cracks and hacks” for their drop in sales, and soon the MPAA will be no better than the RIAA. The **AA’s are ruining art :sigh:. They need to just resign to the fact they are going to lose some sales to piracy and start trying to save the costumers they still have.
     
  9. specofdust

    specofdust Banned

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    The **AA's are running art in the states, pretty much. However, the further they push the more people will push back. Eventually one party or the other will one.
     
  10. donald82R0

    donald82R0 Banned

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    My advice

    Change to any open source operating system (like Linux, FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, OpenSolaris). Nobody should be FORCED to pay for every crappy operating system Microsoft makes, and then have to buy a 2000$ PC, in order to be able to run it.

    Or just forget it, and go back to your f***ing games, you braindead zombies.
     
  11. specofdust

    specofdust Banned

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    Now that was just nasty. No-one is forced to pay for this thing, people choose to pay for it.

    Obviously open source software is lovely, and I'm sure many people here(including myself) use it. Windows may be fairly crappy, but many games won't run on anything else, and that's what the majority of people here are going to use their PC for, whether you approve or not.

    Thankfully some dev houses are making games that run natively on 'nix too. Kudos to ID and Epic for that.
     
  12. my58vw

    my58vw Plexi Expert

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    Long live OSX... runs even on 300 MHz systems!
     
  13. Malvolio

    Malvolio .

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    300Mhz? Geeze, I've got XP running great on my old celly 233...

    Whoever says you need the most robust system to run XP obviously doesn't know how to actualy change settings. Patience is a virtue when working with older systems ;)



    On topic though, I honestly don't see these specs being unrealistic, we're allready seeing more and more 256MB video cards, infact most of the uber-high-end cards are hard to find in 128MB versions. 512 isn't as far off as one would think ;)
     
  14. bubbacola2000

    bubbacola2000 New Member

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    Vista and low-end PC's

    Tried the Vista Beta on my DELL - a Dimension 2400 with 384 MB, and the Intel Extreme Graphics Chipset built-in. Vista installed very easily - but of course did not have a driver available - only for nVidia Cards, etc. I simply downloaded from Intel the Develper Pack for my Card an i845 and manually installed the Driver. Up and running - but a tad too slow. Switched to Classic View and still had problems with my TV-Card - even though it has its own internal MPEG2 chip as Vista has a feature to let it decide how to handle multimedia apps and graphic cards - disabled those services - and I was back down to running like I was running XP Professional with everything working correct.

    The lite version of the OS does not have "glassy" effects - but looks the same - just not transparant. My thoughts about it is that Vista will just simply be dumbed-down for computers running at less than 1GB memory and as such not an exciting enough reason to buy it. If it come pre-installed with a new Computer - might get it.

    I expect Gamers to also disable the services for their cards to play older games. I am not a gamer but Half-Life ran OK within Vista on my DELL after disabling the services.

    I doubt if folks will be running out to buy a new system just to watch Hi-Def on their Computer - for as copying - a HandyCam works if nothing else - so what this benefits anyone is beyond me.
     
  15. bubbacola2000

    bubbacola2000 New Member

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  16. bubbacola2000

    bubbacola2000 New Member

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    My Final Thought about Graphic Requirements for Vista

    The Intel Boards use integrated chipsets for Graphics and basically they are software drivers - about like software modems. The driver that runs my MOBO graphic subsystem only recently added support for Windows 2000 in the same manner as XP - yes the driver would work - but you were limited to about 12MB of video memory and in XP you have 64MB of video memory. The 9x versions still are limited to about 12MB memory.

    Actually though - you have up to 96MB of video memory available as needed - running always at 1MB until the system needs more - it just reports more memory for those apps that check to see if enough memory is available.

    I expect Intel to update their driver and report 128MB memory if 512MB is available on the MOBO which will run Vista nicely then.

    Just thoughts.
     
  17. RTT

    RTT #parp

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    Thanks for playing :)
     
  18. Da Dego

    Da Dego Brett Thomas

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    :hehe: :hehe:
     
  19. gounta

    gounta New Member

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    Well this could be the turning point to Microsoft. I believe they want to make a big push before they lose more of the market agains the Linux Based Operating Systems. With a program called Cedega (Allows Windows based games to run on Linux) being able to run more games and the speed becoming closer with the exception of a few games like WOW (WOW gets faster FPS on a Linux OS with Cedega than in it's native Windows XP!) and More Gaming companies releasing a Linux Port (which aren't much different to Mac Ports) the change is happining fast. Windows is only really any good for playing Games, if you get a Linux Distro, you have everything. Theirs no running down to the store and blowing $850NZD for Windows XP Pro, then another $300NZD for Office, plus all the other stuff ya need.....see why pirating is huge worldwide......greed is what it is! Now with this coming "New" Windows OS......I'll be watching more people and Companies moving from Windows to Linux.

    The ONLY Advantage Microsoft Windows has over any Linux based OS is the Gaming Area, and the Disadvantages are Huge.
     
  20. JonDixon

    JonDixon Decking is the new modding

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    I still dont think people are getting it. Even moving to linux will not support the playback of HD-DVD without an HDCP monitor.

    HD = Hi Defintition CP = Copy Protection.

    The main part being the CP which is not just at the O/S level but also built into the hardware.

    I have a Dell 17" PC monitor and also lucky to have a 32" hi def TV with HDCP. I can currently play HDWMV material on both. This is not the same as HDCP material.

    The same will apply for linux and Im sure the MPAA will be done on anyone who tries a software hack (if there was one) and it would not be added into any distro.

    HDCP is for tv companies and movie makers to protect their interests. For instance Sky when it moves to Hi-Def will require a HDCP enabled TV to display its signal.

    Most DVD Recorders or Tivo style items will have to have HDCP inputs/outputs and therefore will not allow you to record the saturday night premiere of Sky movies due to it being protected.

    I am sure someone will come out with a hack, same as with region encoding on DVD. But would you have your £2000 tv chipped though? its a little more expensive to repair if the chip screws something.

    No one is asking anyone to buy a new monitor same as no one is saying you have to buy a new TV. If you want to watch movies in a couple of years then you'll need a hi-def player. You want to watch sky, you'll need a HDCP TV if you want to watch everything in its best picture quality.

    All Microsoft are saying is if you want to watch the movies on your PC you'll need a new monitor.

    Some of you need to take a chill pill, and look around, there is a lot more afoot with technology and media business sectors than M$ trying to shaft you again.

    Remember, have a look at which companies own which film/tv studios. Can you spot a relationship?
     
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