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Cooling WC coolant

Discussion in 'Hardware' started by Ener, 27 Sep 2006.

  1. Ener

    Ener New Member

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    Heya all, i wrote this faqish thing on another site and thought i would put it on here, maybe i might get a sticky.
    This is only based on a normal water cooling set up and not dry ice cooling or anything like that

    what to use in your watercooling rig?
    The only things you should use in you water cooling rig is basically water, (hence the name) either demineralized, distilled or deionised water (plus an additive), this is because it has a low viscosity and flows well in the pump (if you wish to run oils or honey you need a different pump)

    But how do I stop algae, moss or seamonkies from growing in my system? (Or help prevent corrosion)
    this is were the additive comes in, people use a lot of different additives, from car coolants, metho and harpic toilet cleaner and special computer coolants, they all work pretty much the same, but each to there own...(most car coolants also include anti corrosion but you should not really run aluminum with copper, but it is advised that you use some sort of anticorrisive anyway as distilled water may effect your full copper/brass system so use something such as a good car coolant)

    Here is a list of common additives:
    Car coolant (either a good brand that’s premixed or a pure one that you mix with water, it is advised as it massivly reduces the effect of corrosion)
    the car coolant also includes nulon car coolant which is a popular choice
    Harpic toilet cleaner (if you cbf to pay some more money but it really does work with a few hearty squirts)
    Metho (a cap or so)
    Alcohol (scotch, vodka, etc. but nothing milk based just spirits)
    Swiftech HydrX coolant
    Thermaltake BigWater Coolant
    CoolerMaster Thermal Conductivity Fluid
    People also add UV reactive dyes to change the colour of their water (DONT use food dye it is BAD)

    Ratios:
    The mixing amount you’re aiming for is not to be running pure coolant, or even 50/50, you only need 10% coolant at the max, but you can have less. This is because the more additives you put in the less cooling power the system will have. also there isn’t much harm with putting in two additives some people also choose to run say a car coolant with a cap of metho as well to get rid of the nastie’s that want to grow.

    when to change the water/coolant
    You dont have to change your water cooling that often, but a good time to change is about every 3 months. If you system is still clean and has no merky water and no chucks in your T line/reservoir then you can bump that up to 6-9 months if you like. Some people do change their water yearly but it also depends on the tempretures you have and other factors like the mix you have used.

    If you are going to subzero temps
    if you are playing with sub zero tempretures then you will have to have a coolant/additive that is or has an anti freeze in it such as ethelyene glycol, ethanol or methanol (there are various others) if you do not your water will freeze causing you to stuff up your pump and maybe some other components


    *when i refer to coolant i also refer to any additives that people may use
    ** I am not responsible for anyone who screws up their water cooling
    if there is anything else i havent put in let me know and i will update it
     
    Last edited: 2 Oct 2006
  2. Pie_uk

    Pie_uk British beef, in Britain

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    good read , cheers good for beginers
     
  3. Nexxo

    Nexxo Stopped treating this country as if it was his own

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    Nice start, although it has some inaccuracies and also some important details left out. It is late now, so I'll get to those tomorrow. Meanwhile read the "So You Want To Watercool Your PC" thread linked in the "Really Useful Threads" sticky, so you don't go over old ground.
     
  4. Nexxo

    Nexxo Stopped treating this country as if it was his own

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    That is not quite true. There are many different candidates available, including low-viscosity mineral oils (Fluid XP is basically a mixture of one of a low-viscosity oil, water and some other additives. Don't ask me how they managed to mix them) and non-conductive Perfluorcarbons.

    The reason water is favoured, besides its low cost, is its effective thermal absorbsion and transfer rate. Viscosity is not the main consideration. Centrifugal pumps manage most oils of reasonably low viscosity reasonably well.

    I think you need to thread carefully here. Methanol/alcohol can react badly with acrylic tops.

    You might want to nail down the car coolants a bit more. Water Wetter used to be an additive of choice, as was Purple Ice. However now the best additive on the market is generally considered to be Zerex Racing (5% solution) by Valvoline. It foams less and smells less than the alternatives, and comparative tests have proven it to offer more corrosion protection.

    Some coolants you mention (Swiftech HydrX, Thermaltake BigWater, CoolerMaster Thermal Conductivity Fluid) are NOT additives but are meant to be used as a substitute replacement for water.

    Running copper with aluminium being a problem is a bit of a myth, by the way. Use the right amount of corrosion inhibitor, and you're just fine. But you do need to flush out and clean your components before first use --particularly the radiator.

    I agree on the food dye.

    A 5% solution is generally recommended by most additive manufacturers. Alays read the instructions on the bottle. It is best NOT to mix additives (espacially with methanol --acrylic doesn't like it, remember?) as how they react with each other can be a bit of an unknown variable, and it should not be necessary anyway.

    Minimally six months to a year will do. Many get away with less.

    ...not to mention what expansion will do to your loop.

    It's a good idea and a nice first try, but:
    - A FAQ should not assume too much knowledge on the reader's side, so avoid abbreviations (metho) and insider terms (running copper with aluminium). You'd have to explain these.
    - Some other things remain unexplained. Nasties in your loop? Corrosion?
    - Writing is a bit chaotic and rambling right now. People will not follow much of it.
    - Check your facts! Some facts are inaccurate, and you know what they say about a little bit of knowledge... Also, moss doesn't grow in any loop (algae and bacteria can), and seamonkeys?!?

    Try again. Clean up the writing a bit, can the abbreviations, check the facts. Think about your intended audience.
     
  5. Fibbles

    Fibbles New Member

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    Leave out the seamonkeys, they're brine shrimp and I've never heard of shrimp in a cooling loop (unless they were placed there on purpose anyway). My Goldfish, frogs and newts loved them.
     
  6. Nexxo

    Nexxo Stopped treating this country as if it was his own

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    Perhaps Ener has some tropical fish in there too. :p They'd need to eat something... :D
     
  7. Ener

    Ener New Member

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    this was just a rip of what i wrote on a major Australian forum answering all the water cooling questions people had (basicly like 7 about the same thing in the page) i just answered it and thx for the replys i gotta read em again its late and im tired its basicly not using as much technical **** like people dont know moss doesnt grow in there watercooling system if they are noobish i just means anything bad

    metho= metholated spirits
     
  8. Nexxo

    Nexxo Stopped treating this country as if it was his own

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    It's "methylated spirits". ;)

    Look, Ener, I'm not dissing you. I'm just saying that if you write an authoritative FAQ you have to gear it to your (newbie) audience, be clear and be accurate. If people screw up their system because you got your facts wrong, a disclaimer at the bottom won't help.
     
  9. KayinBlack

    KayinBlack Currently Rebuilding

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    If you're ding this, be sure to warn about the flammability of methanol.

    I ran it once. Shatters acrylic blocks, fumes get yo hig, but it's lightweight and lower surface tension. I don't try tricks like that any more. I got a family now.
     
  10. cpemma

    cpemma Ecky thump

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    'Soluble oil' (a stable water-oil emulsion) is used as a cheap cooling lubricant for turning, drilling, sawing, even steel cold-rolling. Comes as an oily liquid, add 10-30 parts water and stir. Maybe has some useful properties for the water-cooling fans.
     
  11. unrealhippie

    unrealhippie New Member

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    Actually you should favour destilled over deionised as deionised will start to ionise once again when in contact with most materials.

    Also if you check out XtremeSystems and their FAQ you will see lots more info on watercooling, link here

    Oh and Pentosin G11 and G12 are meant to be really really good additives, here
     
  12. Nexxo

    Nexxo Stopped treating this country as if it was his own

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    There is no appreciable difference between distilled and de-ionised water.


    G11 and G12 are more or less the same as Zerex Racing.
     
  13. Ener

    Ener New Member

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    i dunno people make big fusses about water cooling... nothing that wrong with running tap water and harpic toilet cleaner :p

    (sure a disclamer will help i dunno what they are really gonna do if they forget to add water or something)
    and i still dunno how you got methonal from that metho has always methylated spirits
     
  14. Nexxo

    Nexxo Stopped treating this country as if it was his own

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    :sigh: Methylated spirits ("metho") is a mixture of ethyl alcohol (95%) and methyl alcohol a.k.a. methanol(%5). That's how I got methanol.

    If you are going to purport to give an authoritative guide to water cooling, you should get your facts straight, your terminology clear, your language precise, and make sure that your information is reliable and valid. FAQs are NOT opinion pieces.

    Else no matter how well intended, you are not being any help at all.
     
  15. Ener

    Ener New Member

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    all i know is alot of people run a cap of metho and some form of car coolant to mix their system (1-10%) i never told anyone to run scotch and metho in the loop, and all i did was answer about 15 post that had cluttered a watercooling page
    (ps you poms take **** to seriously)
     
  16. Nexxo

    Nexxo Stopped treating this country as if it was his own

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    My point is that you answered them unclearly, and partially incorrectly.

    Now you can continue sulking about us pointing that out and how seriously we take ****, or you can take it on board, and re-write a clearer, more accurate FAQ that will genuinely help people and deserves to be on this forum (as I keep inviting you to do). We want your contribution. But for it to be a sticky, you'd have to make it a very good one.
     
    Last edited: 2 Oct 2006
  17. Marci

    Marci Ex-O-CuK / ThermoChill

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  18. Ener

    Ener New Member

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    yeah i know about that. that is why alot of people run say nulon car coolant and a cap of Methylated spirits
     
  19. g0th

    g0th New Member

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    Not a bad post, i do agree with Nexxo's ideas however, if a definitive guide is what you're trying to accomplish, which if so, is a Good Thing.

    It's only blocks that have Polycarbonate (Lexan) tops that can craze if exposed to alcohols i think, not sure if Acrylics will do something similar or not.

    Ethylene Glycol is an alcohol too, although i'm not sure if it has a similar long-term effect on these plastics.

    Note that some anti-freeze compounds have Methanol or other alcohols in them sometimes, so if you have cast plastic components such as the above in the fluid system, then you will want to avoid this - you don't really need anti-freeze type additives - unless of course you have peltiers or vapor compression systems delivering sub-zero water.
     
  20. G-gnome

    G-gnome Peter Dickison

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    We use BP Clearedge soluble oil with our mills and lathes (and just about everything) at my engineering course. Great coolant and water-like viscosity. I'm going to read the data sheets on it, but I've been keen to try it in a WC loop for months (prob try it in my current project). Not sure it's stability over time though (whether the emulsion seperates or breaks down). Worth a try, eh? :baby:

    Oh and nice comments too Nexxo. So much vague info about on this subject it's good to get straight, clear, unambiguous facts. Posting an FAQ in a forum full of experts... :naughty: :cooldude:

    Ener's heart's in the right place though - props for making the effort to help out others Ener. But yeah, these 'poms' do take their cooling seriously :)
     
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