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What's stopping you from investing in HD DVD or Blu-ray?

Discussion in 'Hardware' started by Guest-16, 11 Aug 2007.

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What's stopping you from adopting HD DVD or Blu-ray?

  1. Either of the other format: I wish HD/BD would die and not have exclusives!

    19 vote(s)
    24.4%
  2. Cost of players

    16 vote(s)
    20.5%
  3. Cost of media

    3 vote(s)
    3.8%
  4. HD-who-gives-a-monkeys! DVD is good enough quality!

    14 vote(s)
    17.9%
  5. Cost of HDTV

    8 vote(s)
    10.3%
  6. Dual format players to arrive

    9 vote(s)
    11.5%
  7. Cost of Dolby TrueHD/DTS Master HD Decoders to come down

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  8. HDMI 1.3 wide adoption: there isnt any point until it's all there

    2 vote(s)
    2.6%
  9. Decent quality movies I actually want to buy in HD

    2 vote(s)
    2.6%
  10. Decent quality extras to make it worth the money

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  11. I have a huge DVD collection I don't want to rebuy

    5 vote(s)
    6.4%
  1. Guest-16

    Guest-16 Guest

    After watching the DVD version of the Bourne Identity last night (in the run up to Ultimatum this week!) on a 720p hooud luckerdertuv (HD LCDTV), I finally realised how crap DVD quality is, especially upscaled. True, I've been spoiled by watching HD DVD Superman last week testing the Biostar/MSI IGP boards but I'm finding myself willing to actually go out and pay the extra for the likes of HD DVD 300 and probably the Bourne series if it wasn't for the competing formats.

    However I know there are some who won't pay more than £5 for a disk (or, at all, but that's another discussion) no matter how much they want it, and there are others who think HD is just over rated. So, are you waiting for one format to die? prices to drop? dual format readers? cant be arsed with HD-anything? prices on disks to drop?

    Give us a min to make the poll :D EDIT: GOGOGOGO
     
  2. Brooxy

    Brooxy Like a boss (but not a boss)

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    To be honest there are several reasons for me while I won't be investing in either technology. First off, I spent far too much money a month on driving lessons, bills and beer, that I can't afford the equipment, also when I can afford to invest in either technology, I wouldn't want to spend £xx.xx on a player, then find out that the format is being cancelled, or both are being replaced by a new technology.

    Maybe when I have money (basically, passed my driving), prices drop, alongside either a format dying OR dual format readers, i'll consider buying into one of these.
     
  3. steveo_mcg

    steveo_mcg New Member

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    I'm not terribly interested until one format, don't care which really (but another beta max would be funny), shrivels up and dies. But tbh i'd need a new TV a new player or at least a better pc doing the ht bit and then i'd need to start buying movies i don't have many dvds but i resent paying over the odds for hd. In summary i'll wait till my old crt tv packs in at which point i'll get an hd tv and hopefully one format will prevail and the cost of players and media drop.

    @Brooxy: Once you've passed your test all your money will dissappear into the black hole in the ground that is your car!
     
  4. DougEdey

    DougEdey I pwn all your storage

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    Cost of DVDs is cheaper then HD-DVD. Oh, and I don't watch a lot of movies more then once so I see them at the cinema.
     
  5. tzang

    tzang Traditional Nutter

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    The format war is annoying and I'm siding with steveo on this one. Blu-ray has the upper hand in this battle, mainly with larger capacity and more companies investing on the technology. Other than that, the costs are still pretty high at the moment but it will come down a fair amount over time... a bit like CD writers in the mid-90s, which cost about £300 for a 2x write model (pretty sure it was a lot more when it was first introduced but I'm not that old to remember that far back :D).
     
  6. capnPedro

    capnPedro Hacker. Maker. Engineer.

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    All of the above. Seriously.
     
  7. dom_

    dom_ --->

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    My problem is the not knowing who will win. When a winner is declared i will invest.
     
  8. Fophillips

    Fophillips New Member

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    I don't see any real benefit to switchgin from DVD to HD-DVD/Blu-Ray. The difference between VHS and DVD was massive, but 480i to 720p isn't a big enough jump to warrant forking out for a new player and a new telly. The AACS means it will never work on GNU/Linux or similar (legally). Also, you need to connect your Blu-Ray player to the internet to stream media around your home.

    Also, the DMCA does things like this:
    Translation: please purchase another copy of content you have already paid for, thank you.

    Attempting to remove ludicrous restrictions like region encoding may cause your player to self destruct

    The biggest lie of all is that we even need these new technologies to have HD video on a disc. DVD video has been around for almost 10 years now, and since then vastly superior video compression technologies have been introduced, namely MPEG-4 and all its variants (h.264, DivX, XviD, etc). These compression formats are absolutely amazing in regards to size vs quality. A hi-def movie in any of these formats could easily fit onto a dual layer DVD, which holds about 9 GB. The only problem is that you can't really 'update' your existing player. In the consumers' best interest, what they would do is release new DVD players that not only supported these newer formats, but also had the ability to be upgraded for future technologies. We wouldn't need these expensive blue lasers to fit more data on a disc. Unfortunately, this solution doesn't line the pockets of shareholders and executives, so it is unlikely to happen.
     
  9. Demon Cleaner

    Demon Cleaner New Member

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    I thought most HD and Blu-Ray discs were encoded in h.264? And you're right, you can just about fit a movie on a 9GB dvd at 720p in h.264. But for 1080p, you'll need a larger disc if you want an adequate bitrate. Besides, most people want special features and stuff (and I think HD/Blu-Ray discs have seperate 720p and 1080p encodes on the disc aswell). So in my opinion a larger disc is needed. And 3 HD format players would totally confuse the market so that alternative isn't feasible either.

    I just wish both sides could have settled their differences and not made competing formats. From what I've read; it's really hurting early adoption, and I for one won't invest until there is one winner or the price of dual-players is cheap.
     
  10. notatoad

    notatoad pretty fing wonderful

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    physical media is obsolete. the future of media distribution is broadband, and i don't see a need to pay exorbitant amounts of money while the movie companies figure this out.

    and i've only got a 22" monitor, no tv. kind of makes HD an overkill
     
  11. Awoken

    Awoken Gazing at the stars

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    Biggest Problem - No point in picking a side just to see it die a death 6 months later if the other side wins.
    Second biggest problem - I don't think DVD movies (or audio CDs for that matter) should cost more than £10 given the tiny cost of production, its pure robbery at £15-20.
     
  12. Guest-16

    Guest-16 Guest

    Capacity. Means. Nothing.

    HD DVD has a triple layer system that fits 51GB on a disk and EVERY HD drive ever sold can read them. I will bet a big buck that it's still cheaper to make than a BD-DVD. It takes several million to invest in BD authoring and stamping facilities but HD can be adapted from DVD facilities for just a fraction of the cost. Extras? Chuck em on another disk, 95+% of people don't watch em anyway. Extra disks are expensive for BD but not for HD.

    Also BD-DVDs are not as scratch resistant because the readable layer is closer to the surface, and from experience need much more careful handling: extract more money from you. Replacement? Warranty? Not on media.

    Capacity makes no difference because after a certain encoding rate you can't physically see any difference and there are many more numerous limitations to the system. There's still plenty of room for a very long movie and HD audio, of which is lossless so should be the lowest bitrate possible, otherwise the lossless codec isn't any good.

    New BD features can't be played back on some early machines, because they didn't finish it in time, whereas HD features are an extension of older DVD technology and you can get stuff like PiP which is on the 300 disk.

    BD used to use MPEG-2 HD, which was ****, but now uses MPEG-4 AVCHD (h.264) exclusively (afaik). The Casino Royale disk is one of the best examples of it. VC1 is used on HD and tbh I can't tell a difference: it's all down the the authoring. HD also has the option of using h.264 as well, of which, some disks are filtering through with it so no need to author two compressions.

    DRM: HD has only the single AACSS (?iirc) but BD has the option of using the extra encryption (argh I can't remember it). Both players have a "phone home" feature built in but HD movies are NOT region encoded. BD movies ARE into three regions, A to C.

    I'm still siding with HD and hope they pull through, it makes more consumer sense, but ultimately BD will win because they have the weight of Sony and a few other exclusive studios, Apple and Disney, so the "family" group sewn up more or less and now porn as well. HD on the other hand has no exclusives and no such critically important market positions afaik apart from MS, which has done quite a **** job with the 360 drive (noise). Only price is in its favour and that won't last forever.

    HD did a lot of pricing incentives and extra movies in the states but not over here afaik and Microsoft could have REALLY pushed the 360 by including it internally like BD and PS3. That's the biggest hitter.

    Fophillips: China has a competing format called EVD which uses a cheap and typical red lazer and a normal DVD authoring, but these better compression formats to fit more in. However the uptake is minute and limited to the few small Chinese companies still atm.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 11 Aug 2007
  13. Gravemind123

    Gravemind123 avatar not found

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    You bring up a lot of interesting points bindi, I think once I have the money to go one or the other the format war will be over, and from what you have said, I like the sound of HD-DVD a bit more, no regions and all. At the moment I can't even afford an HDTV personally and my parents aren't going to buy one. Even then the players are so damned expensive, so I think I'll just wait it out, for now DVDs are good enough quality on my standard def setup.
     
  14. Dogers

    Dogers New Member

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    It's gaining traction over there though - I was there in Feb and EVD players are literally everywhere! From electrical shops to supermarkets :eek:

    I almost got a chance to play with one, but damned if I couldn't figure out the menus :)
     
  15. cpemma

    cpemma Ecky thump

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    Until BBC/ITV transmit a large fraction of their stuff in HD, getting kitted up in the DVD player department is, to me, a waste of money. I'll stay with the fairly constant (and good) quality across live TV & DVD and watch based on content rather than watch a so-so film on disc just because it's HD.
    But this is like the audiophile nut who gets this fantastic soundstage in his "listening room" sat in the one sweet spot, move his head two microns and it's gone. It's just not family-friendly. Sit with your nose glued to the screen and see the HD in all its glory; sit a few feet back with the wife and kids and the advantage is lost. A bit like using your 8Mpx camera for web photos. You're viewing the technology, not the content. Mr 100% Geek, a sad lonely *******.
     
  16. Guest-16

    Guest-16 Guest

    Maybe true, but as soon as my parents get a HDTV I'll be taking home a HD/BD movie and doing the "non educated" test.

    Doger: Didn't know that! Thanks for the info :)
     
  17. m0ng0lh0rde

    m0ng0lh0rde New Member

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    This needed to be a allow multiple answers poll..

    For me, it's all three of the top reasons.


    Story I heard on the radio here today (USA) is that the format war is going into high gear for X-Mas this year, so maybe, if nothing else, prices will drop. Maybe get a decent dual-format player, for less than my monthly house and car payments combined....
     
  18. Hiren

    Hiren mind control Moderator

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    After seeing both Blu-Ray and HD-DVD in action, I can say I was totally underwhelmed. I see no reason for this new standard and won't be buying a "next gen" player until something of mine breaks and I'm forced to.
     
  19. dragontail

    dragontail 5bet Bluffer

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    I'm still waiting for a HD/BR release that makes me go "wow, this is sooo much better than DVD (and worth the price of the equipment and media)".
     
  20. Bl4ckM0onk3y

    Bl4ckM0onk3y in luv 2.0

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    First of all don't have the money for it , standalone players cost too much , no dual format players. I watch most of the movies on my pc , so i am waiting for AFFORDABLE Dual format writer for pc . Since it will take 12-24 months or more to HD writable media to be popular the prices won't go down so fast now .
    It would be nice to record one 20gb disc and not 5 single layer 4.7gb discs ;] but as always we must wait for the market. The company that's going to release the dual format capable reader writer will be the winer since ppl don't whant to choose between the formats , i like the current situation with the dvd's there are dvd-r and dvd+r and i would like to se dvd-hd + BR drives.
     

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