Discussion in 'Article Discussion' started by Combatus, 18 Apr 2016.
DOOM Open Beta Impressions
Agree with Stale...
Tried it too, Power rangers came into mind :/ Also missed movement speed from Q3.
I don't really understand all the bashing it's getting at the moment.
It is a tad slow, I do feel the same. But it still feels very coherent and, for me at least, fast-paced enough. It is not the same game as the 23 year old original. But then, why would it be? If all you want is the same game as back then, which I loved and still do, grab the original or wait for SnapMap and rebuild it in the new engine. Sorry, but everything they added gets torn apart right now. Fair enough if it is crap (loadouts are to a certain degree something that just does not feel right in a DooM game) but succesfully performing a Glory Kill with the world seemingly standing still around you while you literally rip the other guy to pieces (especially when you manage to do that to a Revenant) is just oh so satisfying.
All in all I do like the new DooM so far. Even though for me 90+% of my time will be spent playing the solo campaign.
And, finally, nothing against you personally, but I do get the feeling that many of the bad reviews and rants for the current beta are based on the pent-up rage and disappointment with DooM 3. Because DooM 3 was not what fans of the series wanted (it was okay, the add-on even good, but it was NOT oldschool DooM) everybody is now expecting the new one to basically transform the FPS world like the original did. Impossible today, but still so many people moan about things that are not bad, just not what they wanted.
What's with all the Doom 3 hate? Sure it was different to the older two Doom games but it was a good game in its own right. The single player campaign was fun twelve years ago and the graphics were stellar for the time. Multiplayer wasn't fun but then we had UT 2k4 in 2004 (duh).
Also have you actually looked at the Doom games recently? They are a blurry mess without a real coherent theme. Why would we want something similar twenty years later?
IF the single player campaign can be played in co-op on PC I will get the game for the story. It's the same as above: The new Unreal Tournament is shaping up to be awesome (and free), so who cares about the multiplayer of Doom 4 anyway?
you cant make a proper FPS when catering to the limits of a joypad.
I didn't want to be the one that poked that hornets nest though.
I'm actually really looking forward to this.
Maybe like Need for Speed if I expect the worst I may be pleasantly surprised?
I have not once in the beta gotten the impression that the controls are in any way shape or form worse than pure PC shooters.
Agreed. Doom and Shadow Warrior were about speed. Nothing feels better than dodging a dozen plasma balls. I fear they slowed the game down for framerate reasons.
TL;DR= less dress up dolls, more prizes dangling over lava.
The controls in of themselves are fine. It's everything else from the movement speed to the shooting mechanics to overall balance that get shifted to cater to the slower and less precise control of a joypad.
The movement speed (relative lack of) is the most obvious and irritating symptom though. While I'm at it, can games please stop having those little numbers pop out of enemies heads when we shoot them? It's horrible looking and immersion breaking, if I ever meet the guy who invented it I'm going to crush him to death under a giant 100, one hit kill brah!
I played on the PC and now no issues with the PACE of the game, but the speedy flow feels absent, and that's a real loss.
I actually loved DOOM 3, but for a DOOM game what I want is the flow of the original. There's a comment up here saying the game is a blurry mess, and i'd disagree - I still play it on Multiplayer Lan with a group of friends (and sometimes even at live events I've organised) once every few months, and it holds up. Honestly, this new DOOM's multiplayer feels like a weak imitation of Halo.
This is a shame because even if i didn't rate it much, DOOM 3 multiplayer did fascinating things with lighting, i'd recommend anyone check out the DM.
Just my totally unscientific and probably bias opinion but it's not that the controls are effected, it's the effect the control mechanism has on a FPS game-play and design.
Take for instance the 4 slot loadout, done IMO because having too many weapons available when playing with a joypad becomes problematic in multiplayer FPS.
Then there's how you, as a game designer, deal with the difference between the linear based movement system of a joypad and the velocity based movement of a mouse, something that seems to have been dealt with by the damage output of the weapons, mechanical skills with a K+M take a backseat so joypad gamers don't feel that the game is unfair or unbalanced.
Again just my totally unscientific and probably bias opinion but i also get the impression that when designing a FPS for joypad users you're forced into making gameplay choices preferencing luck and not mechanical skills, every joypad player turns and aims at a fixed maximum rate so it's less about whose quicker on the draw and more about pot luck.
Are you guys playing this at 4k with a 980ti?
game is lush,
The test for me is, do I want to fire this game up again after playing twice on the weekend and the answer is yes.
All of the inputs made which would be wrong to disagree with only means to me that some one needs to make this kind of game you are painting and include VR because it will be a sure fire sale?
Doom is impressive and yeah its power rangers, that's a good phrase term there tip hat. but so what, game is addicitive and nice on the eye, all the long in the tooth talking about 20 year old games... could be we are not meant to be playing any more lol
Personally I think the biggest problem for Doom 3 was that it was reviewed based on what it wasn't rather than what it was. I really enjoyed the hell (arrgh, didn't mean that dreadful pun) out of it. The one thing I wasn't keen on was that it was so dark for most of it you couldn't see how good it looked, for 12 years ago admittedly. I just loved the way it was put together, I thought the weapons were pretty good (loved the sound of the plasma gun), would have really loved the rail gun from Quake 2 but you get what you get.
I reckon the Doom reboot looks good from the videos, I'm only in for the solo campaign, but anyone can do a good video. I like the analogy with being a shark and "you move or you die" seems a perfect summation of what the game appears to be about - whether or not that translates into a good FPS game is something we'll find out soon. They can have my money for this, if it gets poor reviews I can wait for the price to drop, I did for Colonial Marines and it was so disappointing even for three quid in Asda's bargin bin.
Out of interest and one of the most important discussion points here about the game because at the end of the day the game does succeed at having a great time and people will want to go back to it again and again for many years to come.
The important question is this.
Since the game opened as alpha or beta or testing etc.
All this rich wonderful valuable precious and high level feedback that is coming out of the woodwork from you tube, from forums etc.
What are ID going to do with it?
Is the reason for opening it for free because they are some 3,4,5,6 months out from final release and want to consult and get the final changes to perfect the game like velocity of the players? the ability to pick up foes guns.
What is the point of opening to public for beta / alpha if the feedback is not taken on.
I think that's the missed point here from the review, ideally we could have dug in a little deeper and found out what is the ETA for the game, what is the design goal from the vendor, do they want the game to tick all ppoints, most, be an all time classic, be a middle ware, be a hardcore pvp, beat quake, be the next great VR tittle in 6 months.
why was DOOM opened to alpha? for what reason?
I enjoyed the game, if I can play it again tonight I would but expect its cut off.
open alpha is opened for another day so Monday can be doom day past how ever much it is already doom day of the week. ha ha
Interesting to view the supposed mecca here;
What I pick up from going back to Q3 is the emphasis on player and the foe and pin point accuracy to the ms.
the scenery is a secondary, vector is primary + velocity.
Doom is very nice and I appreciate the clean nature of its halls, the left foot right foot but it has definitely opened up the game into a different combat direction than Q3,
Is Q3 the holly of holly.
It could be possible with enough pressure and organized cohesion of feedback about DOOM it gets the label as respected by elders as well as the new generation.
How about we get together a suitable bullet point of feedback?
I am old enough to have been on the quake with the mods with the axe and chain.. so I know about quake a little.
Seeing the speed of Q3 compared to Doom today, you do have to ask yourself what is the vendor thinking here, people do want extreme, were is extreme? DOOM doesn't have it.
It could be the game deploys with a primary focus towards normal speed but there be a hardcore multiplayer version?
The game does need a little more brutality, in its current form its soild and ticks boxes but its not enough, it needs intense, so your peak self.
Also were is quad damage vs the beast mode?
Picking up guns?
When you kill 3, 5, 10 dudes where is the call out for that?
game can definitely grow, its not just air being floated ID's way, game will sell but wont be DOOM until the issues get looked at.
Opening open alpha is a solid move if the feedback gets collected, sure you tube is filled with people bitching right about now.
steam providing a solid way for the community's to feedback and make games great... hopefully.
It's funny, because the original Doom worked really well on a Super Nintendo gamepad. Or a standard PC joystick, for that matter.
Six weapons(five if you were poor like me and only had shareware Doom) is a small enough arsenal to be manageable even if you're paging through guns with shoulder keys(the poor man's mouse wheel selector), and dangerously close to the 4-weapon hat-switch selection mechanic that's so popular nowadays.
Interestingly, though it wasn't yet a standard configuration, six weapons works very well with WASD controls, as only the BFG requires a stretch from the asswad cluster.
That all directional input was limited to two axes meant that a single cross-key + strafe modifier was entirely adequate to the task, and similar to the PC Doom experience if you were playing keyboard-only. Remember, in '93 a mouse was still optional on IBM compatibles. Even if you had one, unloading mouse drivers might free up the conventional memory you needed to play the game if you had some huge TSR you couldn't do without.
So we have shoot, run, interact, and a strafe modifier. Shoulder buttons for weapon selection, start for menu access... the original Doom fit perfectly to a gamepad of the era. We don't need no stinkin' thumbsticks!
Use a keyboard for weapons and menu and it even fit on a standard 4-button PC joystick or the then-new Gravis Gamepad.
And here's where I say the REALLY unpopular thing:
The original Doom was faster than modern FPSes because it was SIMPLER. There was no vertical aiming, no scoping, no iron sights, no jumping, no crouching, no inventory of useful items you could carry... just run and shoot.
The more complex a game gets, the less aggressive the gameplay can be if you want it to be accessible. And yes, there is a market for games targeted at seasoned veterans with well-honed FPS skills. Doom is not that market. The very use of the name places it as a mass-market title that will need to be accessible to rookies as well.
Separate names with a comma.