I'm in the UK and planning on purchasing a Dell, which lists no option other than to have Windows Vista Home pre-installed. I'm aware that the Microsoft EULA states that if you do not accept the terms of the agreement, and do not use the software, you should return the product to the manufacturer for a refund. I understand that Dell has previously paid out to customers in the UK, however I'm curious as to whether or not they are legally required to, as I'd like to know where I stand before contacting them. Does anyone have any experience with this?
I thought Dell had an option to not have Windows installed and just get it unformated or with Linux but you had to call the order in for that?
They do offer some systems with Ubuntu pre-installed, but not the Vostro 1310 laptop that I want, unfortunately. http://dell.co.uk/ubuntu ---- Also, I have read up on the EULA for an OEM version of Vista - it seems that it's worded slightly differently from the XP EULA: "By using the software, you accept these terms. If you do not accept them, do not use the software. Instead, contact the manufacturer or installer to determine their return policy for a refund or credit. " I'm not sure whether that still means I'm entitled to either a refund or credit, or whether I might be entitled to a refund or credit.
They don't have to give you credit or a refund, they may choose to, but I know Toshiba have a no refunds policy.
Thanks for the reply Doug. Are you sure that they don't have to? Has it been tested in a UK court? This guy took Dell to the small claims court in Israel ended up with an out-of-court settlement: http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/1,7340,L-3632861,00.html
I read a story a while ago about a guy doing it with HP. It took him months and months, but he got it sorted. He made sure he had a copy of the EULA so he could say that it states if he doesn't agree to it then it seller (I think) has to offer a refund. He ended up slowly working his way up to a top woman who agreed a certain amount and sent him a cheque after a few months. It is odd though, because dell will have paid MS for the licence then will be giving you the money back, but I don't see how they could possibly get that licence back so they are loosing out twice. Which is why it is so hard. Oh yes and they do an N series with No operating system, and the ubuntu ones. But you just have to keep saying that it is those specs of that machine you wanted, you just don't want vista.
When you buy a PC from a big company like Dell or HP, it comes with lots of crapware installed, which Dell or whoever receive a subsidy for. For example, if you buy a Dell, it might come with google desktop installed, which Google pay Dell £2 for per PC sold. By getting many companies to do this (Google Desktop, Yahoo toolbar, trial versions of office, trial versions of photoshop, AOL, Tiscali broadband etc) Dell can actually shave a huge amount off the price computer. If you don't install windows, they can't install this software, and therefore don't get their commission. It would therefore surprise me if Dell gave you a 'fair' deal/refund price for your unused copy of Vista. You might be lucky though, so ring them up and try!
And exactly how much money to you expect to be refunded from a laptop that only costs £379 in the first place? To be honest I'd be suprised if they were required to provide you with a credit or a refund anyway, as you have already stated there's options for buying a laptop with Windows so it's your choice to buy a laptop with it preinstalled.
I read that. Although, I believe the EULA was worded slightly differently in those days. Surely, after taking back the rejected license, they'd just sell it to someone that wants it? I couldn't find the "N series" on the site, but I did find the Ubuntu systems; unfortunately they don't have a 13" notebook available. Are you suggesting that the cost of the operating system is determined by the cost of the hardware? I am 99% certain that the price of Windows is the same for all machines. Of course there's options for buying a laptop with Windows. The problem is that there is no option for buying a laptop without Windows. ---- I feel that we might be going a bit off-topic here. I'm not some open-source, anti-microsoft crusader. As someone who has never been handed an OEM version of Windows before, I'm simply wanting to understand what I should do. I wasn't sure if returning it for a refund is the standard process, but given some of the responses, it would be seem not.
I've looked into this in the past, and it seems that unless Dell explicitly say otherwise then you are not entitled to a refund on an OEM pre-installed copy of vista, but you can get a refund on an uninstalled retail box. i.e. it's upto the discretion of the company you buy it from since they changed the wording in the EULA
I think the best thing to do is ring them and ask before you buy. Remember that Dell don't owe you a laptop without Windows; they're selling the package of Windows with a laptop. It's like if you go to Homebase; you can't buy a dining table without four chairs because they make more profit by selling the whole package. You could easily be able to haggle with them over the phone before you buy, but I personally wouldn't risk buying the laptop and hoping for a refund afterwards.
Wow.... I don't know about that. My Dell Latitude E6400, came with no crapware what's so ever. My system came only with the latest drivers (from Dell), and with all the latest updates of Windows on the Vista disk and on the system. And 2 softwares. Roxio (which is an easy uninstall), and because I selected Vista Business (64-bit), It doesn't have any DVD codecs and on the phone the sales representative asked me if I wanted Power DVD for free, which I said yes to. That is all!. My Vista disk, is ultra clean. It comes with no drivers what's so ever. The only thing you have is the Dell logo on the system property panel, and that's it. Vista on the disk is already activated, and the product key is not requested during Windows setup. Fun test, I attached my laptop HDD on my desktop (see signature, notice how the system is completely different) and accidentally booted from it, and Vista booted fine. However, I got the activation screen requesting me to enter the product key (which I could have done). But I decided, as I booted form it by accident, to not do it. And after I did what I wanted to do, put it back into my lappy and the activation screen never pop-up, and the system runs fine. Anyway, If you are about to call Dell to order your system, you can negotiate a price... I paid my over 2000 $ canadian, ~1 6000$ and with a **** load of upgrades (free DVD burner, free Wireless-N, free shipping (well that's a given), backlit keyboard, 160HDD 5200RPM (form an 80GB 5200RPM)). I order my system from Dell Small business (which I don't have/work for... I am a student. They never asked).
No, that's not what i'm suggesting. Dell won't have bought copies of windows on a per machine basis, they will just make bulk license purchases as and when necessary. As such the cost of the operating system doesn't really relate to the cost of the machine, it's probably likely that the cost of software on cheaper models is subsidised by the sales of their high end range models. Anyway the point I was getting at was even if they did offer to give you a refund I think it's unlikely they would offer 20-25% of the purchase price of the laptop, i.e. the retail price of an OEM copy of Vista Home Premium. Oops, that's what happens when I don't proofread properly. I mean to say you've pointed out it is possible to buy laptops, even from Dell, that don't come with Windows. Therefore there is a choice, it just happens that the specific model you want comes with Windows. That's because Vista on laptops is usually activated by a combination of a key stored in the bios, a digital certificate stored in the Windows folder and a special volume licensing key. If you get hold of software that can retrieve the product keys for software installed on your machine (e.g. Magical Jelly Bean Keyfinder) you'll probably find the key it reports for Vista is different to the key on the authenticity sticker that will be on your laptop somewhere.
Of course, I know this. I was just mentioned that it was using this system. Sorry for not beeing clear. I know that many companies don't use this.
I work for Dell and as far as I know the company isn't obliged to give you a refund. You can ask for a downgrade to Windows XP but you wouldn't get XP discs. You would still have the Vista discs with the Vista drivers but XP and its drivers would be installed at the factory. If you ever decided to do a format/reinstall then it would need to be Vista you installed. I suppose if you kicked up enough of a stink they would refund you or take some of the price of the system if you didn't want it with Vista. Better to call them and order than to order online if that is what you are after.
Personally i wouldnt have thought it was worth the time nor hastle to try and get a discount, also how does the warrenty stand if you install another OS?
I can't see how installing any other os could possible effect your warranty claims in the event of a hardware failure it would really bugger up any hope you have of getting tech support mind. PC world had an incident where one of its monkeys claimed installing linux was grounds to refuse the warranty but i think that was refuted... ninja edit: it was http://news.cnet.co.uk/software/0,39029694,49292745,00.htm
I knew id heard about other OS and warranty somewhere but couldnt remember wether it did or didnt void it..
It doesn't affect the warranty claims on legitimate hardware failure but if you call in saying that your having issues like "drifting cursors" and such and you have linux installed then more than likely you will be asked to reinstall what came with the system before troubleshooting can go any further. Anything that the tech will lean towards software based(issues like mics not working, sound problems, cursors, video) then you may be asked to reinstall back to factory default. The people who have dual boots with windows/linux are the best for troubleshooting because we don't have to ask for hard drive swaps to confirm software issues, just tell us that it happens in two different OS's
