I'm doing some planning for a casemod but I have one problem and two question: 1 problem: I've never done any water cooling ever. 2 questions: Is there any good water cooling tutorials, youtubes, or web pages that you would suggest? How are water cooling systems on taking impacts? (i.e. if you drop a case from 12" up or 1/3 a meter how well would the water cooling system stay together without spilling water throughout the case?)
Read Pete's thread here. I am not sure how well it would stay together - why would you even drop your computer like that?
I think if you dropped any case like that the case would break and the GPU would snap off, the watercooling may survive better as all of it is directly attached to the case. If your dropping it though you have bigger worries really
Personally would have thought that, unless you've left something open, it's more that the tubing will absorb any shock... Well, imho, the most likely components to suffer are the case itself &, d.t. shock, any HDDs in there (which are obviously fixed to the case). 12" does seem like a really odd height to drop something from though... Otherwise, whilst i'm not saying that anything in Bloody_Pete's guide is wrong, once you move beyond some key basics - (i) if you buy cheap blocks, rads, pumps, etc they'll always be cheap... ...decent custom w/cing costs money... (ii) don't buy thin diameter tubing... (iii) make sure that the pump, rad(s) & fans are 'man enough' for what you're actually trying to cool... (iv) don't rush the build job as it's more likely to cause issues... (v) always leak test for at least 24hrs before turning anything on... (vi) & revisit removing air from the system after a couple of weeks... - there's a lot of personal preference in there... Well, as examples for my own personal preference - having done completely 'in case' systems originally, because it gives significantly better cooling with the same components, it's much easier to get more of the air out of the system & i have convenient places to put them for my 2 machines, i use external rads on a stand... ...i use Feser One (black) than water as it saved my first proper build from dying when the shonky plastic adapter for chipset block that came with an Asus Rampage decided to leak post testing - otherwise i'd have lost a brand new board, gfx card, sound card & PSU (~£900 or so of kit at the time)... [NB i've never had a leak since (touch wood), but...] ...i much prefer using jubilee clips, but then i have closed/un-windowed cases - i do it for cooling rather than for 'showing off' (or personally admiring)... ...something like fan noise is hugely subjective - i can filter out the noise from lots of reasonably loud 50mm fans whilst editing audio without any issue (for fine tuning audio then i'd use headphones obviously), but find gfx card fans to be unbearable d.t. the tone they emit... [NB some people cool for the sake of temps, some for noise & some for a combination of both - it's what your preference it...] ...i always use acrylic topped blocks as, whilst you've got to be more careful when screwing in fittings (ie don't over tighten or you'll crack it & have to buy a replacement - never had this happen), it's much easier to know whether you've gotten all of the air out - them & the rad are the most likely places for air to get trapped... ...etc... Yeah, i'm by no means not saying that my choices are 'the best', but more that it's about comparing what's optimal with what you can sensibly do/the level of risk you're happy with/what you aesthetically want/etc... ...& building something that works for your preferences.
1) See Petes thread as already mentioned. 2) Water cooling is a lot easier these days than say 5 or 6 years ago with so many parts available. 3)Don't drop your case!!! It makes me wonder from the way you say it that it's some thing you've done before, possibly on more than one occasion...lol
This is nonsense! Let's take some perspective here. Low(er) flow kits work perfectly well if you have the right blocks designed to make use of it, plus, the advantage is that it's marginally quieter (less splashing in the res) and less hazardous (less flow pressure). If you are pushing cooling to its absolute limits - using TECs or care for a couple of C differences, then yes maybe high-flow/large bore can perform better in benchmarks, but don't discount low flow kits outright! I put a GTX 480 and i7 860 through an AC kit w/triple rad. GTX 480 hits about 65C max in the summer heat!
Just running through things to comment rather than 'attacking' here - just sometimes what i write can be misconstrued... Or rather i don't want this post to be. i'm not 100% sure what you're referring to a "an AC kit"... ...well, i assume you mean something from Aqua Computer... ...however, i can't see a 'kit' as such &, looking at the block specs on their website, they don't appear to be ltd to a specific tube diameter. i was, more specifically, referring to the hugely thin 6mm (1/4") ID tubing (rather than suggesting that you needed sewer pipe sized tubes) which i actually used on my very first w/c build... Yeah it was fine for a cheap kit for a minor bit of o/cing on a 3.2GHz socket 478 P4 & to learn what i was doing before buying something proper (it was even more of a niche idea at the time), but it certainly wasn't impressive in its capabilities. No idea what you're referring to by "less splashing in the res" - though i guess that it 'may' be because i went for the XSPC top on the DC1 Ultra... Well, if i heard a splashing noise, something very serious would have gone wrong. Then as to temps, it's possible that what we view as "a couple of C" is very different from one another (this is a more discussive bit) - initially, it's not abundantly clear if (a) your 65C for the 480 is at 99.9% load (with the CPU also at 99.9% load), (b) what your ambient temps were/are or (c) whether both were run at stock - so i'm going to have to assume that (a) it was, (b) your ambient was ~35C & (c) they were (otherwise you'd have probably mentioned it to indicate the prowess of thin tubing/low flow)... Now, obviously, we're not exactly comparing like with like here, but i could not get my 580 above 41C at 99.9% load (with the 2600K at 4.8Ghz @ 1.425V @ 99.9% load simultaneously - the later bioses helped to reduce the voltage a bit but...) on one of the few hot-ish days we had early in the summer (35C(+) in the room - obviously not helped by the extra heat output), with dramatically increased voltages & clocks... (Well, i like to test things to see what they can do - hence running both at 99.9% load simulataneously to see the worst case temps scenario - though i clocked the gfx card back somewhat after playing with it.) ...however, any loss that you might have had within this comparison in extra heat that needs dissipating d.t. the difference in the cpu & gfx card (whilst the tdps are very similar, i believe that both of yours run hotter at stock) is, i believe, going to be more than made up for by my o/cing - thus allowing the temperature comparison to be reasonable on the basis of the initial assumptions being true. [NB if the assumptions are wrong, it could either limit the difference or increase it - well if (a) both CPU & gfx card weren't at 99.9% load then there's more of a difference, if (b) the ambient was higher then less or lower then more & (c) if you were o/cing both then there's less of a difference.] ***it'd be good for clarification about the initial assumptions so that the comparison can be adjusted*** Now, obviously, this difference isn't solely down to tubing & i'm in no way pretending that it is, but it is an indication that there is more than "a couple of C" difference to be had by choosing a high flow system (with blocks & whatnot to suit) vs a low flow system (again with blocks & whatnot to suit). Anyway, i will alter my statement & accept that there 'could' be a place for low flow & über-thin tubing (with blocks & whatnot to suit), but with the clarification that, 'if' someone's after top notch cooling, it's not the best option.
Thanks for the input so far. To clarify, the height I specified is purely arbitrary. I'm working on a case design that will be able fit in a back pack and to take an impact from a certain height or distance (i.e. dropping the backpack from your hand to the ground or a 'short distance') and still be able to function as a kick-ass gaming computer. I've already taken into account of securing the GPU, frame design, SSDs, and PSU. (more details when I start the work log). I'm really curious to see if I could put a water cooling system in the case and still be to take an impact without spilling liquid throughout the case. I've been looking into Asetek's sealed loop cooling systems as a possible solution (http://www.asetek.com/partner-products/pny/gtx580-gpucpu-cooler.html). But these sealed loop options don't exactly capture the sense of style I want in the case. I can go with an air cooled system but that brings up a different argument of designing cover slots for the air vents when the case goes back into the backpack.
Mmmmm... it now sounds more as though you need to be investigating cushion curves for different materials for contructing the backpack based upon the dimensions, weight & likely drop distances in order to reduce the shock to a safe level - in no way at all anything to do with any field of my expertise, so can't advise. But, whilst you're going to need to make sure that you've both filled the res as much as possible (so that air it less likely to make its way around the system) & made sure that the fill cap is water tight (plumbers tape?), (again) i don't think you stand any significant risk of leakage simply from shock.
It's not attacking it's just a clarification made on a sweeping generalization. Even if you didn't mean it that way, with respect to his intentions as a novice ruling a small diameter kit outright is not ideal advice. An yes, Aqua Computer. The Germans generally specailise in low flow WCing, although my kit is no longer available on their site. Generally their blocks maybe now more multi-functional though - I haven't checked in a while. With regards to 41C vs 65C - OK that's impressive but both are hugely within their maximum temperature tolerance, and realistically GPU ocing yields not a huge amount of extra FPS. My reason for watercooling was that GPU was hitting 100C and maxing out the fan in the ~32C room temp, so respectively watercooling has yielded a far, far quieter gaming. It depends what the OP wants to WC for: looks, temp/OC or noise!
Misunderstanding - i wasn't saying that you were 'attacking'... Simply making sure that you didn't read my response as being so as i know i can come across as being 'slightly' venomous at times - usually it's (at least semi-) deliberate, but i had rewritten some of the last post several times to try & tone it down towards where i actually meant it to be (ie non-confrontational), but thought it better to add the first line in just to be on the safe side. Anyway, all's good with me. Yeah, i agree that GPU o/cing doesn't yeild fantastic results (hence why i'd clocked it back having played) & that, with any water cooling, it's about being having a set up that's sufficient to able to remove enough heat from all the components in the loop... ...but, the more you can remove, whilst you can still have quantum tunneling issues over the long term leading to cpu/gpu degredation, you'll still be greatly improving the general longevity when increasing the voltage to o/c. Moving away from temps, i do agree with your other rationale for water cooling - that of the noise from GPU fans at much more than idle load... Personally find them unbearable/unworkable with d.t. the tone - whereas i've got numerous 50mm fans in here & they never bother me (though with fine audio adjustment then i wear headphones - though there's all kinds of external noise to justify that). Anyway, i guess, with my re-writing the statement about tubing in the last post then we're in agreement - which is certainly a good thing.
I think we've both shot past the point though as monkeyfun has just mentioned Aestek rather than full blown hardcore setups
Yeah, but where's the fun in not going completely OTT in the occasional discussion? & at least, from my perspective, it's great for it not to be about... ... ... Ummmmm - what are those things again... ... ... Oh, right, that's them... ...SSDs for a change.
Before you read Pete's thread, start at the beginning and read this. Comparative testing (yes, science: it works!) has shown that 6mm tubing leads only to a few degrees loss in performance compared to 1/2" tubing. There is no appreciable difference between 1/2" (12.5mm) and 3/8" (10mm) tubing. Even 8mm tubing performs nearly the same. The problem with water-cooling will be the weight of the coolant and radiator. Blocks are not that heavy. If you keep the loop as short as possible and really anchor the radiator solidly then you might possibly get away with it. However few computers are designed to absorb drops and you may find component failure kills your PC before the coolant does. Those HDDs do have glass disks in them...
IF you decide to go for this I would choose an SSD for the bootdrive and games, and 2.5" harddrives for storage. The SSD will be perfectly fine after a drop since it has no moving parts and the 2.5" harddrives should only be online when you are accessing them, and even if you drop it while the computer is running the lower mass of the 2.5" will significantly reduce the kinetic energy when it eventually hits the ground. I would go for something like Crucial M4 128 gig SSD WD Scorpio 1tb As for the rads I would go for thin rads, again - lower mass equals lower kinetic energy when dropped.
