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Portable So I bought a Microsoft Surface RT...

Discussion in 'Hardware' started by Nexxo, 5 Jan 2013.

  1. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    Bound to happen. After all Windows 8 Atom devices are hitting the market with comparable performance and no restriction, so people are going to ask why you can do things on this here Atom tablet while you can't on that there virtually identical ARM tablet.

    And the Surface RT would make such a cool little hacker's device. It's bound to be appropriated for that use.
     
  2. rollo

    rollo Modder

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    It's been jailbroken into let's see what the community does from here with it.
     
  3. AbeArceo

    AbeArceo What's a Dremel?

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    I just received a Surface RT over Christmas break and came across this thread while I was searching for info on editing flash sites on the white list, so thought I would chime in - hope Nexxo doesn't mind!

    2. So in regards to the videos on Escapist videos work, they work fine. But like many sites you will need to add the site/source of the embedded video. I've done this with about 4 or 5 anime sites and they are all working, along with the videos on the Escapists site. Just look into the page source where the video is and you'll find that info

    4. I was actually holding off on the RT so I can get the Pro, which is why I didn't get one at launch. But after a couple of months of evaluating my needs I came to the conclusion that I don't need the pro version. The main desktop apps that I would use are Dreamweaver and Photoshop. So my away around that is to use VPN and Remote Desktop, or Teamviewer. Both options work out great.

    Other than accessing those two programs, everything else I need is web based. Metro IE is really responsive and I've been happy with it so far. I will admit that it would be pretty cool to play desktop games on the surface pro, especially since I'm on the road a lot. But again, I wasn't looking for a full laptop replacement, just an iPad and Android tablet replacement, which I found in the RT.

    My kids are now using the Android tablet for their games and my wife is using the iPad for media consumption.

    Also, my wife had some input on the additional $400 for the Pro version:p

    For image editing I've been using RDP or Teamviewer to access Photoshop on my laptop or desktop. I would like to see a good image editing app, even some version of snaggit would wonderful.

    Again - I hope Nexxo didn't mind that I jumped in and I'll be more than happy to help answer any question (I have blue touch cover too).

    Thanks!
    -Abe
     
  4. Yslen

    Yslen Lord of the Twenty-Seventh Circle

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    It depends on what people are buying a tablet for. I think Microsoft could find a considerable market amongst people who want a tablet that replaces the PC they still use from time to time but don't necessarily need to upgrade, or those who would like to be able to use PC apps on the move.

    Imagine a sub-400 GBP tablet with build quality, battery life, display quality/resolution and weight to rival the iPad. Then imagine that it's running x86 Windows 8. Suddenly you have an alternative to the iPad that can fire up Lightroom 4 on a train and catalogue some photos, or do basic audio editing for a podcast.

    You might find software that could do these things on an iPad or Android tablet, but it's not the same software you use on your desktop/workstation laptop, it's a mobile app that you're making do with. With a full version of the software on your tablet you can sync data over the cloud and keep working - so long as you're not doing anything massively intensive - on the go. It's a huge advantage and something I would love to see.

    Then you get home and your tablet also lets you sit on the sofa and play games; not just the tablet games you find in the app stores, but a whole load of indie titles from steam, or pretty much anything from the GoG catalogue. Age of Wonders on a tablet? Or Uplink? Monkey Island? Baldurs Gate? Half Life 2?

    Anyway, that's what I want to see. I have a laptop and a tablet at the moment to compliment the desktop I use for actually getting things done. I would love the option to combine the two into one device.

    You may well be right that the surface (and work on ARM-ing Windows 8) had already begun long before decent low-power x86 chips began to emerge. You'd think they would have had a chat with Intel about their plans before going ahead with it though!
     
  5. Yslen

    Yslen Lord of the Twenty-Seventh Circle

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    I'm not sure this is entirely true. My laptop is nowhere near as powerful as an i5 and I use it for basic photoshopping all the time, as well as optics design / ray tracing simulations. I think there's a market for a lower power x86 solution which is primarily a tablet but also allows you to finish up on some work on the train home. The Surface Pro is fine for something used all the time, but as a secondary device, which tablets are when compared to desktops/workstations, I think something less powerful is needed in the lineup.
     
  6. rollo

    rollo Modder

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    Your in dream world if you expect a quality x86 tablet for £400 its just not going to happen. Even if apple made it with there supply skills they would not get it below sub £700.

    Only way would be for it to be heavily subbed by intel and Microsoft and sold at below cost. Dou't intel or Microsoft could afford to rack up the loses it would take. Not to mension the public expect a new model every year. The companies would never see break even.

    Andriod has done the cheap trash tablet for years its never sold, nexus 7 showed what consumers want a quality product.

    Maybe tablets is the next big thing with the smartphone battles well and truly over with recent results showing a even bigger gap between Samsung / apple vs rest.( the crazy statistics have apple and Samsung taking in 110% of all profit in smartphones, due to Nokia rim loses.)

    Wonder if Nokia htc are ready for a tablet battle rumours of a Nokia surface rt are rampant on the net.
     
  7. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes How many wifi's does it have?

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    rollo, computers WITHOUT gaming graphic cards, and low poor quality used to cost 2000-3000$ US, just a couple years ago. Now they are significantly better, significantly smaller, now 400-600$. And even if you build an over the top high quality, custom build solution build by someone, you'll end up under 1500$ with a 23/24inch IPS monitor.
     
  8. rollo

    rollo Modder

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    My mam has a computer without a gaming graphics card it cost about £400 8 years ago from pc world(single core 800mhz cpu) and with the SSD upgrade it recieved its still more than fast enough for her purposes.

    For at least the last 10 years maybe more dell would sell you a £400 box that does word proccessing dont know where the 2-3k is from as thats just crazy talk. UK is the land of the rip off and ive never seen a £1500 to £2000 pc in the shops in a long time that comes without a graphics card.

    X86 in the tablet space with it been quality + cheap is dream stuff for now and by the time its doable will anyone care for a tablet? Most are dust collectors or email facebook devices.
     
  9. Archtronics

    Archtronics Minimodder

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    Predictions point to tablets combined with cloud computing replacing computers in 5 years so is a powerful tablet really that unlikely?
     
  10. rollo

    rollo Modder

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    At the £400 price point I think it is. The surface rt with an arm CPU is £400+ I dou't intel or AMD will ever make a cost effective CPU that could compete with the arm chip.

    The arm chip in the surface was quoted at only $25 for Microsoft from the tear down.

    Quality screens will always cost quality prices. Apple and Samsung can offer top notch screens due to how many they are ordering will any other company be able to do this have my douts again.

    If the surface pro hits the uk market around £800 its done well to expect us to get a similar quality tablet for £400 just seems like crazy talk. Pcs went down as companies raced to the bottom, I don't think tablets will do the same, there is little reason and as a netbook has proved over the years people don't want cheap crap.

    5 years time tablets will be nothing but a passing craze something else would of come out that is the next thing in portability. The netbook was quoted like this before the whole x86 thing it just never took off. Even ultrabooks are a sales failure.
     
  11. javaman

    javaman May irritate Eyes

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    ATM the galaxy note 10 its £399-499 price range. We're also spoilt with the nexus 7 for £200 and playbook for £120. Until further part maturity comes about £500 in my eyes is the competing point. On the other side however, a NetBook went for under £200 constantly. Does a touchscreen, ssd and 1GB more ram really add £300?
    its what Yslen said. notepad ++ or some other coding environment is not available for Rt or Android. The occasional deus ex should be playable, even wow on low. The real issue is is there room for this with ultra portables in the market? If like me you have you're laptop hooked up between various Tvs tablet browsing would be better over using a phone. I would also be more likely to take a tablet on the bus and into work than a laptop but the issue is would I take a 10" in? I'm still not convinced on size and weight. In my mind and usage model this is what I would aim for. I'm not convinced the right product is on the market for me however especially price.
     
  12. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    Not at all. :)

    You'll have to help me out here. I added <domain>escapistmagazine.com</domain> but it isn't working for me. What am I doing wrong?

    By the way --I have found that you can change the default search engine to Google. If you change it on the desktop version of IE by adding the Google search provider plugin in the address/search bar as per usual --which you can do even on Windows RT-- and set it as default search provider, it also becomes the default search engine on IE Metro. :)
     
    Last edited: 8 Jan 2013
  13. Guest-16

    Guest-16 Guest

    You're missing the point: ARM apps can't run on x86. So, follow what software you want. If you want Photoshop-CS something then you must have an x86 tablet. Simple as.

    Also I doubt Surface was a 2 year development. 9-12 months I expect and the reason they went ARM was price.
     
  14. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes How many wifi's does it have?

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    2 years development is possible. It depends on where you start counting. Do you start counting when the idea was thought off, polished and submitted? or when the team was assembled completely, everything setup, and THEN they started working on it which is where you start, or some other position in time.
     
  15. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes How many wifi's does it have?

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  16. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    I agree. I know that Bindi is likely to have a lot of insight into these processes due to his job, but usually the development of a new device from scratch takes about three years. The iPad was already on the drawing board for that time when the iPhone came out. It may well be that at the time when the Surface RT hit physical prototyping, the Tegra 3 was state of the art in ARM. Things move so fast in tech at the moment...
     
  17. Yslen

    Yslen Lord of the Twenty-Seventh Circle

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    What's all this about it not being possible to make an x86 tablet for under 400? It's perfectly possible. Plenty of much cheaper low-end laptops around.
     
  18. Yslen

    Yslen Lord of the Twenty-Seventh Circle

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    Wait, that was my point? Wires crossed somewhere I think, never mind ^^

    EDIT: Just re-read what I said and realised what you mean. To clarify, I'm saying that I'm not convinced you need an i5/i7 spec machine to run photoshop etc. Like I said, I get a whole load of work done on the go using a low-power AMD laptop. It's perfectly fine for a secondary device, and I'd love to get that kind of power into an x86 tablet. It's a £270 laptop with 10-hour battery life. Must be possible to make a tablet with similar specs.
     
    Last edited: 9 Jan 2013
  19. rollo

    rollo Modder

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    If it was it would of been done I'd assume by intel to counter the iPad sales.

    Problem is the low end laptop market is basically dead. Consumers now want quality.

    The best low cost laptop is the chromebook and its not x86.

    The future of the market may be away from x86 you just never know, surface pro once released will show what intrest there is in such a device. If its not high then i don't expect an updated model once haswell is out. Same with the whole windows rt still missing some of the bigger supporters ( not just a surface that you can get)

    If the past is out to go on x86 tablets have been a dissaster. Apple did not make the worlds first tablet was made well before by others was just the first one that sold.
     
  20. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    X86 tablets were not a disaster because of the CPU as such, but because of the untouchable :)p) OS and the poor battery life. And the cooling that they required.

    Current x86's are becoming a different ballgame in terms of cooling and battery life; not quite there yet, but close. And as far as Windows is concerned, especially its Metro/Modern interface just works really well with touch. You have to use a Windows 8/RT tablet to realise just how much Microsoft managed to pull a rabbit out of the hat. Make no mistake: this ain't no XP for Tablets or HP Slate anymore.
     

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