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withholding P45

Discussion in 'Serious' started by Margo Baggins, 16 Nov 2011.

  1. Margo Baggins

    Margo Baggins I'm good at Soldering Super Moderator

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    Hello ,

    Is it actually an unlawful practice?

    I spoke to my previous employer yesterday to raise that I hadn't received a P45 and they have bought up an overpayment that i was unaware of until yesterday - an overpayment I also find hard to accept as I had 6 days of holiday in the bank and I got paid 1-18th of the months, worked the 19th, left the 20th, so in effect 7 days in the bank - But some of this was un- accrued holiday but all the same, I left in september, there was only 3 months left of the anual leave year, given I got 22 days a year holiday, tht is approx 5.5 days accrued in a quarter, therefore I cant (by my math) have been over paid.

    Just need to know where I stand, I want to contest this overpayment, I also want my P45!
     
  2. M7ck

    M7ck Ⓜod Ⓜaster

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    It is a legal requirement that they provide you with a P45 however it is not entirely needed for you to have. If you are starting other employment you can fill in a P60. Write to your employer and request it again.
     
  3. cjmUK

    cjmUK Old git.

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    AFAIK, it is illegal to hold back your P45 if they have made their final payment. If they have made a mistake (holiday entitlement/expenses/etc), they must handle this separately...

    http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/employers/p45-employee-leaves.htm#9

    However, IANAL, so I suggest a double-pronged attack; contact your local tax office and either your union or the CAB.

    Also, you can fill in a P46, to request a new one.
     
  4. Margo Baggins

    Margo Baggins I'm good at Soldering Super Moderator

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    Well they are adamant they are not going to give it back until i settle this overpayment - which is by all accounts wrong. It would be right, if I didnt have holiday in the bank, which they are saying doesnt count as it was carried over from the previous year.... I'm a bit irritated by all this. I think I will just fill out a P46 and treat them with the same respect they have me when they want their money. Well i guess they already do want it! If only their letters they have apparently been posting had gotten to me, could have got angry and worked up about it months ago rather than letting it ruin my week this week.
     
  5. PabloFunky

    PabloFunky New Member

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    I believe you can obtain it from the Tax office anyway, Im pretty sure if the Tax office gets onto your company they will send it pretty sharpish.

    Im pretty sure its a legal requirement and they cant hold it back.

    Best ask Bloggins for some info i think on this.
     
  6. thelaw

    thelaw New Member

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    I would tell them to wipe there arse with it and then eat it after.

    Fill out the p46 and be done with it, make sure you rub the fact it in there face by telling the boss "its not really going to put you out holding it back from you because you will just simply fill out the p46 with your new employer and let the tax man chase them direct for the information, now i am going to have a beer paid for by that 'overpayment' "

    There is only one um in this world and that is f* um
     
  7. MrWillyWonka

    MrWillyWonka Chocolate computers galore!

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    It doesn't matter if your holiday was from the previous year, these holidays have to be used first and I am assuming you have already used up these days. In addition for any holiday that the company has allocated to you in any annual leave year, whether from this year or last year, by law the company must pay you any legal minimum holidays you have not used (in proportion to when you have left in relation to the end of the annual leave year).

    Even if you do not obtain your P45 and decide to ignore it, your previous employer may go through the legal route to claim the overpayment. So, do not ignore it and a trip to the CAB may be in order.

    Also have just found this:

    Which would suggest you do not have to pay back "overused holidays".
     
  8. Margo Baggins

    Margo Baggins I'm good at Soldering Super Moderator

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    Its really annoying, as i had to fight to get the holiday in the first place, which i lost through their ignorance the previous year.

    I worked on a department where it was closed over christmas, no choice, but if you didnt save annual leave you wouldnt get paid, so i saved 6 days to cover that, then got a new job in a different department, who weren't closed over christmas, but i had made clear my booked authorised holiday on the application, had raised it in the interview, but when i was on the team they told me there was no holiday left as otherwise staff requirements wouldnt be met, and then they said that they didnt carry annual leave so i would just lose it. my team leader was really busy and so was the campaign manager and they just kept not dealing with it, so i wrote an email asking my floor manager who my HR representative was and which union i could join in order to get some guidance as i felt i was being unfairly treated, to which i got told that i should have talked to my team leader rather than emailing a manager who is obviously too busy, especially throwing around terms like HR and unions (her words). Obviously though the next day i got told they where making a exception and carrying my holiday over to the next year. now obviously they are playing hard ball. I figure p46 was going to be the logical route i just wanted to know if there was anything else i could do.

    before i left there was also an incident with them not treating my information too responsibly. I dont know if it counts as a data protection breach, but if it does I think i want to make a complaint to the information commission just to give them a hard time for a while... Ill explain...

    I had handed my notice in, and had an agreed leaving date with my bosses - standard procedure when leaving somewhere. I got home a few days after I handed in my notice, to a message on my facebook from some guy i literally knew 10 years ago, and havent seen in as long, saying, oh so your leaving on the 7th october, how do i know that?! Weirder thing is, he lives in wimbledon..i live in brighton, but there is an office in wimbledon. Turns out his girlfriend was the account handler for the campaign i was working on, and apparently they had been discussing at great lengths all kinds of **** about me, reasons for leaving all kinds.

    Im SO glad i do not work there anymore, I was treated like an idiot child. I mean, im a bit stupid and that, but this was next level. Like all the bad bits of school magnified a million times over, i only got a job there as i knew anyone could get a job there and i stupidly moved back to brighton without sorting out work, but anyway thats all history now.

    /rant
     
  9. MrWillyWonka

    MrWillyWonka Chocolate computers galore!

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    That certainly looks like a breach of data protection act as well as harassment so my advice would be to report all these to the relevant agengies, also make a copy of the facebook comment as it could easily be deleted by the person from Wimbledon.

    In addition, DO NOT reveal on these forums who you were working for as you may well had a clause in your contract which states you cannot spread bad word against your company, even after you have left.
     
  10. Margo Baggins

    Margo Baggins I'm good at Soldering Super Moderator

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    yeah yeah i know not to divulge company names - but thanks for the advice :)

    Have already taken a screen shot - cant be deleted though as its a message rather than a post, like a pm, so it will always be in my box.

    thanks for your input :) well see how it goes in the week, suppose I should get to writing some letters.
     
  11. WarrenJ

    WarrenJ Well-Known Member

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    Personally i would do everything in a letter, and send everything first class recorded. If you do that it becomes a legal document they have to respond to.
     
  12. Krazeh

    Krazeh Well-Known Member

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    Not necessarily. It will all depend on how the information was obtained and passed around. The DPA isn't going to get involved if, for example, it was all verbal information, i.e. you spoke to your boss and said you're leaving, your boss then tells the account handler, the account handler then tells their friend etc. The DPA would only apply to the use (or misuse) of recorded information.

    Oh, and if all you're looking to do is give the company a hard time then a complaint to the ICO is unlikely to achieve that aim, especially if it's the first time the company has been complained about. All that'll happen is they'll recieve a couple of letters and if it was found to be a breach of the DPA they'll get told what they should do differently in the future to ensure it doesn't happen again but nothing major will happen.
     
  13. Margo Baggins

    Margo Baggins I'm good at Soldering Super Moderator

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    Well it wasnt word of mouth - the person works in another office, I have never met them before in my life! The company has had many complaints against them, they aren't one of the better ones.
     
  14. StingLikeABee

    StingLikeABee New Member

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    Just playing devils advocate here, but without knowing exactly how the information regarding your departure from the company was divulged, and in what context it was divulged, how can you say with any certainty that the DPA regulations were breached. As already mentioned, there could be legitimate reasons that your leaving the company were made known in another office. If you really feel the company has breached DPA regs, then it's worth pursuing. On the other hand, if your motives are retaliatory, then it does seem pretty silly.
     
  15. Margo Baggins

    Margo Baggins I'm good at Soldering Super Moderator

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    You're missing the point. Or maybe I probably haven't explained it properly. Obviously, the information would have been discussed in the Wimbledon office, that is not a problem. The account handler works their, that's her office. Her going home, and discussing with her boyfriend, who is not a company employee and does not need to know the ins and outs of my departure. That's what I have a problem with - taking my information out of the (metaphoric) company walls and shared with average Joe, I just so happened to know him when I was a teenager.

    Anyway - my P45 is being sent out, my old boss e-mailed me today. So that's good.

    And no - it isn't purely retaliatory, I would like to think that employees of any organisation I work for would have the integrity and acumen to properly safe guard my information.
     
  16. StingLikeABee

    StingLikeABee New Member

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    I did miss the point about it being a boyfriend of an employee so apologies for that. My error there. It does certainly sound like there has been a breach of confidentiality, more so than a breach of the data protection act. I would imagine that the employee who divulged the information would have been bound by confidentiality agreements within her employment contract. If she broke this contract, the fault would lay at her feet and not the company's. I'm sure that the company in question would have a duty to act upon any breach that came to light though. I'm only theorising here, as I have only a layman's understanding of the law.
     

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