Photos Grandfather [update 15/09/2011]

Finally had some time to honour Pookeyhead's request. Here is the same shot, different crop, in color. I really like it as well, maybe I was just a bit to quick to jump to the sepia processing. I'll have to sleep on this one!

Let me know what you guys think!

 

mmmm, I really like it in colour as well.

 

I prefer it in color.

 

+1

 

He's suddenly alive: Here and now. I just got the feeling the mono one was backward looking, and a little clichéd.

I much prefer this one.

 

I have to say I like the B/W pic better - excellent pics

I say this with no knowledge about photography etc just my opinion.

I would say the black and white pic is timeless.... the colour pic seems to involve a time, not sure how to word it........

its like the black and white pic depicts the man, who he was etc and the colour pic is all about what was happening at that particular point and the emotions involved.
it can be looked at differently when its not personal I suppose......

 

Yes.. it does involve a time... now!

Who he was? He's still alive. It's a portrait of him now. Why make it timeless and retrospective.. it's a portrait of the dude now! Just because he's old you make it black and white? Do old people not belong in this era?

I'm sorry.. I have to disagree completely. Old people in black and white is just a derivative cliché, and mildly insulting IMO... like they don't deserve to be treated as contemporary subjects... that they belong in the past. It's as if we've decided they're dead already.

Colour for me, all the way.

 

Pookeyhead, I got stuck in that mindset when I went with the bw at my first try with this shot. I'm glad I had a go at a color version as well. And I do prefer this one over the bw, so thanks for the suggestion! It is much appreciated and actually better advice then I got at a photography forum!

 

Another vote for the colour pic here. I think the latest image really 'pops'

 

No problem. It is just my opinion however... there's no real wrong or right here... but... it IS a cliché to shoot old people in black and white, as if they belong in a bygone era, when in reality, they are here and now. They were young in that bygone era, so why shoot them when they're old in such a way?

Just makes sense to me.

 

My bad 'who he is', you get what I meant so why be a smart ass ?

age has nothing to do with it, it works with young people, architecture, machinery etc etc

from a photography viewpoint - its always subjective when its not personal to you. the black and white person depicts the man and each will take meaning from it in a different way. In colour it takes on a personal feeling that only a person connected with the subject can truly appreciate.....

 

I'm not being a smart arse. It does kind of make my point for me though. It's interesting you used the past tense when talking about him don't you think? Why do you think you did that? Something to do with the fact that it's an old man in a black and white image that has connotations of the past? I bet you wouldn't have done that if it was colour.

So I can only appreciate a colour image if I have a personal connection with it? To have universal appeal it needs to be black and white? What an odd thing to say. I live in a world of colour... why should I only be able to appreciate black and white?

LOL

OK.

 

You are definitely being a smart arse, this is not your classroom........

If you want to to be technical, every picture is past tense.....

did I say what you said? were those my words??? dont think so

The subject in the photo's is a loved one (to the OP) how can I TRULY appreciate all the warmth in that pic when the man has no meaning to me??? when I look at pictures of my family and kids and show them them to people, they dont know what was happening at that particular time or the emotions involved.

Ive tried to be honest and explain myself, hoping that an outsiders view might be of interest and I get flamed!!! I am not your student and neither are the people on this forum.

 

I fail to see how I'm being a smart arse. You yourself used the past tense when referring to him, not me. "its like the black and white pic depicts the man, who he was etc". I was making a point that you said that unconsciously without knowing. Why use past tense? Why does it show him as he WAS? This is what black and white portraits often connote, especially if the subject is elderly.

But what has this got to do with colour or black and white? Again, you said...

"its like the black and white pic depicts the man, who he was etc and the colour pic is all about what was happening at that particular point and the emotions involved.
it can be looked at differently when its not personal I suppose...... "

and....

"from a photography viewpoint - its always subjective when its not personal to you. the black and white person depicts the man and each will take meaning from it in a different way. In colour it takes on a personal feeling that only a person connected with the subject can truly appreciate..... "

Whether the man has no meaning to you has nothing to do with whether it's black and white or not.. that was my point. According to you, "the colour pic is all about what was happening at that particular point and the emotions involved" so if that's the case, you should be getting a better idea of who he is from the colour image, surely?

My first response to you in this thread was not a flame at all, or personal in any way. I was merely disagreeing with you and explaining why I felt so. You decided to elevate it to this level when you called me a smart arse merely for having the temerity to question your judement. Is that how you always deal with people who disagree with you?

To me it was VERY important than you referred to him in the past tense, and I would be willing to bet that if the original was in colour, you;d have done no such thing. You could have debated the point in an adult fashion.

Just to make it easier for you... here was my original response to you.


"Who he was? He's still alive. It's a portrait of him now. Why make it timeless and retrospective.. it's a portrait of the dude now! Just because he's old you make it black and white? Do old people not belong in this era?"

"I'm sorry.. I have to disagree completely. Old people in black and white is just a derivative cliché, and mildly insulting IMO... like they don't deserve to be treated as contemporary subjects... that they belong in the past. It's as if we've decided they're dead already."

How is that a flame?

I'm neither treating you like a student, or anyone else in here. It's a thread dedicated to critique. If you can't handle it, leave. No one else in here was getting upset, including the author of the image being critiqued, so what the hell is your problem?

 

why should you question my judgement ???what or who gives you the right to do so???

I did not elevate this, it was you questioning that brought this on. simple.

if the way I was brought up, the age/ society I live in etc etc has influenced me, into my subconsiously thinking that a black and white picture of a grandad looks best and you have to judge that......
then I think your in the wrong forum. go on a phsycology forum or something.

FFS! - I think the black and white pic looks better than the coloured one.

Now if one was to judge yourself.... well I wont go there, this thread has been derailed enough. its obvious that you have the knowledge when it come's to photography, experience and intelligence.

....... but the one thing that outshines the above, is...... arrogance. oh well....

Hmmm... superiority/inferiority complex or a mental impairment/disability or disorder, maybe something on the autistic spectrum or just outside. It depends which camp your in when classifying disorders such as asperger's.

but hey ho, its just my opinion, nothing wrong with that is there.

 

as allready stated - every picture is 'past tense' it WAS taken at such a time ie not now

No not surely.... those emotions are there but each person will percieve them differently. so no, I actually get a better idea of who he is from the black and white pic.

this is not your thread.

There's that 'temerity' again (arrogance in other words)

jrs77 i see why you left

Im not the one who has a problem,

 

Please, show some respect to Pookey MAN!
Let him say what he has to say , this thread is the perfect example of why he´s so precious to our forum without him we would never know the color picture is way better than the b/w and I really liked the b/w one however this color one is really wonderfull.

I´m no one in this forum and so are you, respect and gain some knowledge about rules of friendship.

 

You're just being pedantic. If I took a photo of you today, you would regard is as current. You wouldn't think of it as the past, nor would you refer to yourself in the past tense. You would think of it as a current photograph of you now. You wouldn't say "That's how I was" because you'd probably look the same, feel the same, dress the same.. it would only be a few hours, or days ago. Everyone would regard it as current, and no one would say things like "That's how he used to be", or "That's how he was".

You know this is true... you're just being a total ass hat about this.

The right? I didn't think I needed one. Is your judgement beyond questioning? Yeah.. you prefer the black and white one... we get it.. OK? LOL Does that mean we either have to agree with you, or ignore you? If anyone challenges your opinion you accuse them of arrogance?

Whatever. Clearly I annoy you. Can I suggest that you ignore me then? I'll reciprocate... I promise

With all due respect... I am not RIGHT, any more than Zuko is wrong. ...and I'm not suggesting that the colour picture being better is a fact either... The whole point I was trying to make was merely don't go straight to the black and white option just because it's a portrait of an old guy. Keep options open.. ignore rules.. challenge things, and ultimately test them out before assuming anything. Personally I think the colour one is much more characterful... others agree.. some don't. I'll argue my point to a degree, but.. (shrug). It's not that it was black and white that was the issue... it was the acceptance that it would be better in black and white just because of the kind of image it was... that colour wasn't even considered. All I said originally was "Can I see it in colour?" LOL

 

I may perhaps be the only one that got that ;-) . I did went the bw route, just because of the kind of image it is. Again, I'm thankfull you pointed it out and glad I had a go at a colour version as well.

I'm just a hobby-photographer with good equipment (compared to my skills) and I'm thankfull for all tips & critique I can get. I very much appreciate the critique here (bouth sides!). As I pointed out before, it's more then I got at a photography-forum. All that I learn I'll take with me to the next photograph/post processing! I'll try everything and then decide on my own what I feel is the best option. In this case : color!

 

I felt that you were being that way with me and how am I to have any chance talking photography with an expert

My judgement was'nt put on the plate in the first place, it was my opinion. nothing more, nothing less.
yes you did annoy me, but I wont ignore anybody that has the balls to fight there corner. I am not here to make enemies or ignore people and TBH I hope that you dont ignore me.

I now see the what you are trying to get at, but to me... you came at it from a technical point, with experience and expertise. where as I came from the simple point that to my tastes I prefer the B/W. if you would have put it like that to me then there wouldnt of been a discussion. lol
I think some internet speak has gone on. lol I find it hard to talk/type my thoughts so maybe its all just a big misunderstanding.

@Gunter. yes you are right to a degree, but respect is earnt. I am a noob yes and I definitely appreciate that I have to earn my place in social standings etc etc but I wont be walked all over because of that.
Forums are problematic for that kind of thing, I allready had a certain amount of respect for Pooky, 1000's of post's and an obvious knowledge of photography so yeah maybe I shouldnt of been all gung ho but I hope to some degree that I have earned a teeny little bit of respect for fighting for what I believe in.

Pooky Head ??? while I may not of earned your friendship I hope I hav'nt made an enemy

Good day to all